Sunday, August 20, 2023

Meir Pogrow: Rav Chaim Malinowitz' response to the question of whether Pogrow's Torah shiurim should be removed

update: Just informed that that Torahdownloads has removed the recordings

update:Just was informed that Kol HaLashon has removed the recordings


כתבנו מעט מזעיר ממעשיו הגרועים.ואף זו ברמיזה בלי פירוט.

לדעתי, ואני מדבר רק בעד עצמי,  זו בזיון התורה ללמוד תורה מן נואף, ממי שעושה  מעשה זמרי, ממי  שעבר על איסורים חמורים במזיד מאות פעמים בחייו --וד''ל. לדעתי זו בושה וחרפה לכם  להגיש  שיעוריו  לציבור. לא מדובר במי שנכשל בעבירה--מדובר במי שחי חיי פרא אדם , לוכד נשים במרמה והרבה הרבה פעמים הרס בזה חייהן.

איזה בושה! איזה חילול ה'! איזה בזיון! וכי תורה היא צעצוע שלנו?

אני מלמד זכות עליכם שאתם לא מבינים המדובר פה, כיון שלא פירטנו יותר ממה שכתבנו.

אני מדגיש עוד פעם שאני מדבר אך ורק בעד עצמי.

מסתמא יש לכם רבנים לשאול להם שאילות שיש לכם, לכו תשאלו אותם.

חיים זאב הלוי מלינוביץ


 Rav Gershon Bess wrote

 I agree completely with Rabbi Malinowitz 


Translation of above =====================================

Question: Should Kol HaLashon remove the shiurim of Meir Pogrow?

Answer:

We have written in the  psak of the Beis Din only a small fraction of his disgusting deeds and even then it was only done with hints without going into detail.

In my view, and I am only speaking for myself, it is an insult to the Torah to learn Torah from a predator of women - from one who does ma'aseh Zimri, from one who has transgressed extremely severe prohibitions deliberately at least hundreds of times in his life. That description should be sufficient for you to get the picture.

In my view it is an embarrassment and disgrace for you to offer his shiurim to the public. We are not talking about someone who had a temporary lapse and succumbed to temptation. We are talking about someone who lived an unrestricted licentious life - trapping women through deception and many many times destroying their lives.

What an embarrassment! What a chilul HaShem! What a disgrace! Do you think that Torah is a mere trivial plaything for us?

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you have not understood the seriousness of what we have talked about in our psak since we deliberately have left out the details. But the answer as to whether the shiurim should be removed is obvious.

Let me emphasize and repeat that I am speaking only for myself and not the other dayanim

You obviously have your rabbinical advisors to ask this question. Please go and ask them for their psak.

14 comments :

  1. Rabbi Eidensohn for a good discussion of the issue as well as the pesakim of Rav schachter and Rav Dovid Feinstein listen to the following shiur:

    http://www.yutorah.org/lectures/lecture.cfm/810933/rabbi-aryeh-lebowitz/ten-minute-halacha-learning-torah-from-disgraced-rabbis-(35-minutes-long)/

    ReplyDelete
  2. For those like me who don't speak Hebrew... what does he say?

    ReplyDelete
  3. I wonder if R' Pogrow has any shiurim on the topic.

    ReplyDelete
  4. His shiurim are all מעשה ולא להלכה.

    ReplyDelete
  5. To do a drush on the situation - the name PogroW - if you turn the W upside down, it becomes an M. Thus the name becomes PogroM. since his first name is Meir, then the M is appropriate. The severe sins , which the Torah and Chachamim Z'L warned of leads to terrible results, are encoded in the perversion of the person's name.
    This is an unauthorised drush, and solely the work of this poster.

    ReplyDelete
  6. Anyone know of any mishnayos shiurim online that were just as good, clear, and concise as Pogrow's? I've found some others, but they either had bad sound quality or did not offer shiurim for the whole mesachta. Thanks

    ReplyDelete
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    ReplyDelete
  8. I have to admit - his shiurim on Mishna and Rambam were the best I've ever seen in terms of clarity and pace. His Gemara shiurim were my go-to when I had difficulty clarifying a particular sugya. It's a shame to have lost such a valuable resource, as embarrassing as it is that the resource came from a disgraceful person.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I have been searching high and low to figure out how to get "back copies" of the audio shiurim. I understand that this is a very controversial topic and I render no judgment regarding anyone who says that it is forbidden to listen to the words of a person who has committed crimes such as these. Nevertheless, I agree with your position. If you have any idea whatsoever as to where I can find his mishnayos shiurim, please be so kind as to contact me at either:

      yuvaltheman4@aol.com

      or at

      yuvaltheman4 on telegram

      Delete
    2. How do you know that the way he teaches MIshnah isn't tainted with his immorality? Perhaps there is some perverse underlying message in his teaching as well

      Delete

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