Friday, May 27, 2022

Igros Moshe on Kollel Income

Furthermore it is my opinion that those "Mischassidim" from the side of the Rambam's opinion is advice from the yetzer hara in order that they interrupt their learning and engage in labor and commerce and the like until ultimately they forget even the little which they already learned and aren't relaxed enough to fix even a small amount of time for learning Torah.

Since if the Rishonim were like melachim and said that it was not possible to engage in Torah and become wise in it while engaged in labor to sustain themselves by the work of their hands, certainly in our is not possible for anyone to boast that he is able to engage in labor and become wise in Torah. Therefore do not let the thought arise in your mind that advice of the yetzer hara that with a stipend from learning in Kollel, being a Rabbi, teacher of Torah, or Rosh Yeshiva there is any sort of sin or lack of middas Chassidus, since it is only to instigate one into separating from the Torah.


  1. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 27, 2022 at 5:07 PM

    Gedolim disagree with each other on many things,
    Rav Moshe disagreed with Rav Shach on Entebbe for example
    Rav Yaakov did not agree to pay the extortionate ransom for Rav Hutner when he was held by terrorists in a previous hijacking (Rav Shach always argued for negotiations not military action).

    I'm a nobody, but I did not say stipends were wrong, I said they are right, if they are kosher.

  2. Who are you to agree or disagree with a major psak = who are you relying on?

  3. Above, I didn't say I disagree, I said they (Gedolim ) disagree with each other on many issues.

    I can only answer your questions using logic, which might be unfortunate.

    a) "who are you" - I am me, it is my world, you are just a guest passing by in it.

    b) "to agree or disagree with" - well put, because usually it is "who are you to disagree with. you must agree!" So your phrasing points out that if one can choose to agree , once can also choose to disagree.

    c) reliance : who do you rely on to say that X is a major posek? and that z is the formula for halacha or to choose or agree or accept? You rely on your your own understanding ... of what you have learned..from a teacher ... as opposed to ... another teacher who disagrees.

    Then who does that teacher rely on ? why should I rely on him? Or someone from another town who doesn't agree with him?

    Why, for example, does Ploni rely on the CC and Almoni on Arukh hashulchan? Should I accept brisk, or Netziv or rav kook, or satmar or Chabad or CC or Chazon Ish, or ben ish chai or Rav Ovadia or Rav Goren, etc? If i rely on you tell me , or on R Rakeffet, then there is no thinking, just blind acceptance.

  4. rav hildsheimer and Rav s. R. Hirsch

  5. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 29, 2022 at 1:49 PM

    It is also possible for a major posek to be majorly wrong.

    Example is reb Elchonon's letter about YU, wher ehe says better off dying than living in YU. On what basis? There is no heter to throw away one's life if one can save it.

  6. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 29, 2022 at 2:03 PM

    Rav Hildsheimer
    Rav Hirsch

  7. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 29, 2022 at 3:02 PM

    various support for various views

    1. that there is no infallibility - Tractate Horayot


    שֵׁ֤֣שֶׁת יָמִ֣ים֙ תַּֽעֲבֹ֔ד֮ וְעָשִׂ֖֣יתָ כׇּֿל־מְלַאכְתֶּֽךָ֒׃

    see Sforno, Haemek Davar.

  8. Nope!
    Rabbi Bleich says the experience in Eastern Europe was 100% of those who went to college gave up yiidishkeit
    So the question is do you save your life if you will lose\your Yiddishkeit?
    which of your poskim said it is obvious that you chose life over
    yiddishkei - Rav Goren? or is it your personal psak

  9. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 29, 2022 at 3:22 PM

    BTW, arond 30 years ago, yeshiva rabbis were still saying there is no outright issur on smoking. Things have gradually changed, and now a large number of poskim support my "view" on the matter. In those days it was only a few who outright forbade, such as Sephardi Rav of tel Aviv R' Hayyim David Halevy ztl.

  10. Wow so you are the enlightened one who will eventual be seen as correct

  11. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 29, 2022 at 5:00 PM

    Pretty much every assumption made in the above comment is false, respectfully i will try to show why:

    a) Is that Prof Bleich who teaches at YU all hs life? A litlte ironic?

    b) In Europe , there was a Haskalah and reform movement, 50-80% of Jews in many areas were leaving orthodoxy. Going to college in itself was not the cause, perhaps thsoe who were already leaving religion ended up going to college. Doesnt Rav Dessler say that in Germany they had TIDE and no assimilation, but alelgedly less gedolim; in E. europe they had many hareidi Gedolim but massive attrition to secularism.

    So the simple cause and effect, as well as real data you present is highly questionable.

    c) Rambam states that every person has complete freewill to be as righteous as Moshe rabbeinu, or as wicked as Achav or Yerovaam. The argument you bring is a denial of free will, which is a fundamental part of Orhtodo Judaism.

    d) Your dilemma is totally false. "So the question is do you save your life if you will lose\your Yiddishkeit?"

    Going to YU is not the same as going to Berlin University. In YU , you will meet people like Rav Shkop, Rav Moshe Solovetchik, (in Berlin, maybe rav Hutner, and Lubavitcher rebbe!)

    The shulchan aruch clearly says that sakkana is more severe than issurim. You can eat chazir, lobsters and break shabbes for sakkanah, just like you can eat on Yom Kippur for sakkana. According to your argument, these are all spiritual risks, and should therefore not be allowed - which of course goes against halacha.

    "which of my poskim says choose life"? the Torah says choose life, I don't hav a doubt, and don't need to go to poskim for this. But rambam also says that if you live under a an evil tyrant, you must leave for a safe country, where possible .

    See Yesodie hatorah ch 5:

    כָּל מִי שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר בּוֹ יַעֲבֹר וְאַל יֵהָרֵג וְנֶהֱרַג וְלֹא עָבַר הֲרֵי זֶה מִתְחַיֵּב בְּנַפְשׁוֹ.

    So, according to you, to study accounting, or law, is something that one must die , rather than to do?

    And that is part time, and you have the choice of what to study - maybe study chemistry, or English literature. Where is the evidence that htis is something that is Yehareg v'lo yaavor?

    If so, why don't all chareidim carry cyanide capsules in their lapels, so if they see an advertisement, poster, or tv screen, a western woman, they can take the pill rathe than have sinful thoughts?

  12. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 29, 2022 at 5:02 PM

    that it is good and positive to learn a trade or modern science

  13. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 29, 2022 at 5:06 PM

    Look what happened with the first stage of Covid 19 - originalyl the Hareidim were in denial, and thought they could continue as normal. Sadly they learned the hard way that this was a very serious pandemic, and then began to follow guidelines of the experts.

  14. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 29, 2022 at 5:10 PM

    Rav Goren is a red herring, why bring him in to the discussion?
    Rav Aharon went through a process , of a steep learning curve, to become a major force for saving lives - he would work on sahbbes, work with reform, and most importantly with Hillel Kook. the previous Rebbe Joseph schneersohn attacked him for this. Rav Aharon knew halacha pretty well.

  15. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 29, 2022 at 6:52 PM

    "Wow so you are the enlightened one who will eventual be seen as correct"

    who was it who siad that Daas Torah is not with the Gedolim, but with the people?

  16. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 29, 2022 at 8:13 PM

    here is another gem:

    America and Spiritual Dangers

    “How can I help you emigrate

    to America when you have

    small children? Here we are

    in physical danger, but is it a

    secret that there is tremendous

    spiritual danger facing

    children in America?

    ~Reb Elchonon, p. 383-4

  17. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 29, 2022 at 8:29 PM

    false accusation against Rav Kook

  18. Are you mistakenly claiming that most European Rabbis encouraged Jews to go to America?

  19. Good point -

  20. False can come through a mistake, even a mistaken or false report can lead to an incorrect conclusion.

  21. It's the cyanide test - if every place of geula is so bad, then carry a cyanide capsule, with a badatz hechsher.
    Jews fled Spain and many ended up in other places which had periodic problems. That's no reason to stay and be killed.

  22. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 30, 2022 at 2:41 PM

    More importantly, America is really the only place frum Jews have been successful, outside of Israel. Sure, there are Jews in S. America, S. Africa, england etc - but Satmar, Lubavitch, lakewood etc all moved to America - and the above is again more evidence that so called "Daas Torah perspective" is bad, and destructive - it is from "the other side".

  23. Total nonsense
    saying that it was good advice because their descendants are alive - even though not religious

    That was the original issue - which rabbis said to leave?

  24. many descendants of Yetziat Mitzraim were also not religious, and were idolaters. but that doesn't mean that Yetziat mizraim was a bad thing.

    it's hard to pinpoint who left religion, and why - in America, there were already 5 millions Jews before the War, mainly non frum. Russia had become secular communist, as were other parts of ?europe eg Germany.

    What you miss in your analysis , is that sadly, many survivors, also their families, lost their faith. So even taking the "cyanide" option would not prevent loss of faith and assimilation, unless you kill off everyone - which is absurd.

    it is difficult take this discussion much further, as some people will see your claims or that of the extreme hareidi view as insane, and absurd. On the other hand, the Hareidim, even those who don't regret escaping Europe, will not hear a single word against Gedolim or their decisions, which will be tantamount to "heresy" to object to them.

  25. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 1:22 AM

    you wrote "Are you mistakenly claiming that most European Rabbis encouraged Jews to go to America?"

    The story goes that only the Mir yeshiva escaped, they went to Japan or china. Of course, things changed once the barbarity of the germans became known to them.
    There was someone who had foreseen this - he actually saw what happened to a ma named dreyfuss,a nd made kal v'chomer about antisemitism in Europe. it interesting that many rabbis who met Herzl, disagreed with his programme, but recognized him to be a a great person, almost like "gadol" but a secular version.

  26. “the Rambam's opinion is advice from the yetzer hara in order that they interrupt their learning and engage in labor and commerce and the like” Torah thought this week’s parsha נשא
    “And all that is raised up of all of the holies that the Children of Israel bring to the Kohen, it shall be his. A man’s holies shall be his and what a man gives to the Kohen, it shall be his.” (Numbers 5:9-10)
    במדבר פרשת נשא פרק ה פסוק י
    וְאִישׁ אֶת קֳדָשָׁיו לוֹ יִהְיוּ אִישׁ אֲשֶׁר יִתֵּן לַכֹּהֵן לוֹ יִהְיֶה:
    מדרש הגדול במדבר פרשת נשא פרק ה פסוק י

    דבר אחר ואיש את קדשיו לו יהיו. אמר חזקיה בריה דר' פרנך אמר ר' פרנך אמר ר' יוחנן כל שיש לו תרומה ומעשר ואין נותנין לכהן לסוף בא לידי כהן, שנאמר והביא האיש את אשתו אל הכהן (במדבר ה, טו), ולא עוד אלא שנצרך לו שנאמר ואיש את קדשיו לו יהיו. אמר רבא ואם נותנן לכהן זוכה לממון הרבה, שנאמר איש אשר יתן לכהן לו יהיה. לו יהיה ממון הרבה.
    My theory. A man’s holies shall be his refers to when a person goes to heaven what does he bring with him? His holies, meaning good deeds and Torah study. Further, the holies that the Children of Israel bring to the Kohen, will be the source of blessings in this world to the person of the Children of Israel.

    Thanks KA for bringing the Rambam’s opinion here that we must stand against the advice of the yetzer hara. Not only for merits in the next world but for God's blessings in this world.

    This week's parsha נשא has the Priestly Blessings.

  27. Why change the topic
    The issue was what rabbis were encouraging Jews to leave to America where they would lose their religion
    Hertzl was a fringe character why would anyone view him as an authority for anything?

    Cherry picking with hindsight as usual

  28. The Jews in Egypt were largely idolaters
    You basically are avoiding my questions as you are more interested in Gedolim bashing

  29. cherry picking and embedded messaging.

    The issue raised was Reb Elchonon's specific letter against YU, but where he also recommends other American Yeshivot such as Torah Vodass. So to add "where they would lose their religion" is just an assumption and also not relevant to the letter. There was a second quote from an Artscroll biography where he opposes America in general.

    But, at the beginning of WW2, or even since Kristalnacht, thre was concern amongst all of European Jewry about their safety. I posted earleir that the Rambam says someone who takes yeharaig option when it is yaavor, is liable for his own blood.

    Also, Rambam says categorically that we all have free will.

    Losing religion is no different from eating chazir.

    But it is interesting, since those who took the determinism view, i.e. america will lose your religion, have already lost their faith, and have rejected the concept of free will.
    It's not my fault that Hareidi rabbis no longer beleive in free will or the rambam.

  30. The reason for yetziat mitzrayim was the Israelites slaves were under the burden of slavery, they cried out to their G-d, He heard and He redeemed them. This is part of the Jewish tradition.

    it is not gedolim i am bashing, it is the comncept of Gedolim as being the source of all true and correct wisdom, of speaking "Mi Pi Hashem", of reliance only on their decisions for all matters, and of their crystal clear vision of what will be in the future. I think that criticism actually hurts more than attacking individuals or even insulting them. Shattering the myth of Divine leadership of modern gedolim, is a fundamental departure from how you see religion.

  31. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 1:33 PM

    in any case, you have many yeshivas in america, some were there before the war, so obviosuly the rabbis did move there. SOme moved during the war, and some after.

    Rav Moshe " Under increasing pressure from the Soviet regime, he moved with his family to New York City in January 1937, where he lived for the rest of his life."

  32. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 1:42 PM

    The Rebbe 1941

  33. Nope!

    You are so obsessed with your campaign you dont trouble yourself with mere facts

  34. Nope!
    that is your biased summary

  35. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 2:23 PM

    from hilchot Melachim :


    It is permitted to dwell anywhere in the entire world with the

    exception of the land of Egypt. Its territory includes a square of 400 parsah by 400 parsah from the Mediterranean Sea proceeding westward, bordering on the land of Kush and the desert. It is forbidden to dwell in this entire territory.

    so what is your answer to this, that America wasn't yet discovered in the time of the rambam?

  36. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 2:24 PM

    If the gedolim all told you to take cyanide, woudl you accept?

  37. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 2:31 PM

    Nope, the issue is one of saving life.

    Sakkanah overrides issurim. You can't just say that you will throw this concept away and make up a new one, that anything less than Glatt kosher is yehareg v'lo yaavor. Anyway, why did your family move to america?

    Everything you say is self-serving bias.

  38. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 2:57 PM

    Hilchot shabbat ch.2


    The [laws of] the Sabbath are suspended1 in the face of a danger to life,2 as are [the obligations of] the other mitzvot. Therefore, we may perform - according to the directives of a professional physician3 of that locale4 - everything that is necessary for the benefit of a sick person whose life is in danger.

    When there is a doubt whether or not the Sabbath laws must be
    violated on a person's behalf, one should violate the Sabbath laws on
    his behalf, for the Sabbath laws are suspended even when there is merely
    a question of danger to a person's life. [The same principles apply]
    when one physician says the Sabbath laws should be violated on a
    person's behalf and another physician states that this is not necessary.5

    This is for medical danger, one asks a doctor, and even a minority view is accepted to break shabbat and mitzvos.
    But WW2 /Nazism was a political disease - but experts were not consulted. Would Harieidi Gedolim satisy themselves to ask themselves for medical matters, since they don't trust modern doctors? Usually not. So this is another innovation. it is nto an obsession or campaign, itis an unfortunate neglect of basic halachic principles.

  39. what political experts should have been consulted - Chamberlain?!

  40. Nope saving life does not trump everything!

  41. If Gedolim told you not to starve yourself would you do it?

  42. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 5:44 PM

    Herzl, Herzog, Hillel kook..

  43. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 5:46 PM

    He's not forbidding America.
    It reminds me of the old criticism of reform, that they wrote a new shulchan aruch.

  44. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 5:48 PM

    Rambam's family had a yom simcha for the day he moved to Israel. Do American hareidim have a yom evel for the day they moved there?

  45. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 5:52 PM

    Egypt _ because we are told not to go back. some would not go back to Germany, nobody went back to Hungary, Poland, Lithuania etc.

  46. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 5:53 PM

    Not to starve - depends on what day. On yom kippur I'd ask a doctor whether it's safe

  47. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 5:58 PM

    Yehareg is not a commodity to trade. You'd accept it's temporarily permitted to eat non kosher and be mechalel shabbes if Chas vshalom there is a sakkanah to life.
    Rambam escaped the fanatics in Spain and in Egypt was forced to work 6 days per week, with only shabbes to learn Torah. Why didn't he accept martyrdom rather than to lower his spiritual level?

  48. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 6:32 PM

    I don't know much about Rav Moshe Soloveitchik

    according to his great nephew, Rabbi Meiselman, when the brisker Rov was maspid his brother, Rav Moshe Soloveitchik, he called him a Gaon and a Tzaddik.

    This Gaon Tzaddik moved to America in 1929, and conicidentally taught at YU.

  49. Kalonymus HaQatanMay 31, 2022 at 9:01 PM

    Because there is no such thing in halacha, it is an innovation . Perhaps not even that.

  50. Again you ignore questions

    Why did he go to Egypt

  51. Can someone please quote for me the Rishonim who opposed a Torah scholar supporting himself by his own efforts?

  52. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 1:25 AM

    I didn't ignore. You simply asked why? Not why xyz.
    He left Cordoba because of fanatic Islam and forced conversions. His brother later on died, so Maimonides was unable to live without working. Initially he was the nagid in Egypt, but then became the Royal physician.
    Bkitzur , he left Spain due to persecution and ended up in Egypt having wandered Thru Morocco and Israel.

  53. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 2:38 AM

    you have to look at it from another perspective. Today. nobody would hold such an extreme position. And Lubavitch and then artscroll have shown it is possible to start up an hareidi community anywhere in the world. Even in germany, in Russia they now have yeshivas, glatt kosher options etc. Any antisemitism, and American jews go to their senators to complain. So there is a kind of black hole , during the shoah , where the world went topsy turvy, and even Gedolim didn't have clear answers or thoughts.
    Then there is the issue of actual reality - YU, Rav Chaim's son was the R'Y, until he was niftar, then Rav J B Soloveitchik becasme R'Y - so was this part of the animosity? Was there so much hatred even for Rav Moshe? Did his father disown him? It is unlikely.

  54. Doesn't address the question of why he settled in Egypt

  55. that is equivalent foe a Jewish community going to Tucker Carlson or Meir Kahane or you for guidance

  56. Those who did had a higher survival rate than those with your mindset.
    Rav Aharon worked with Dr kook and possibly rav Herzog. Hillel kooks uncle, rav Avraham kook saved the elyashiv family and many others.
    You did not insult me, perhaps flattered me.

  57. Do you mean why he was permitted to return to Egypt despite the issur of returning there?

  58. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 1:12 PM

    3 of rav Chaim 's main students, rav Polachek, rav Shimon shkop, and his son rav Moshe taught at YU. Reb elchonons son David went to university in Europe and became a frum engineer.
    Draw your own conclusion.

  59. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 2:39 PM

    "In 1165 Rabbi Judah ibn Shoshan, with whom Moses had studied, was arrested as a practicing

    and was found guilty and then executed. This was a sign to the Maimon family to move again, this time to


    which was in a depressed economic state and could not ofer them the

    basis of a livelihood. After a few months they moved again, now to Egypt, settling in

    , near

    . There Jews were free to practice their

    openly, though any Jew who had once submitted to Islam courted death if

    he relapsed to Judaism. Moses himself was once accused of being a

    Muslim, but he was able to prove that he had never really adopted the faith of Islam and so was exonerated."

  60. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 3:05 PM

    it doesn't really matter, they resisted the chavat daat of the Surgeon General for 50 years, and allowed a whole generation to smoke themsleves to death.

  61. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 4:24 PM

    The Bergson Group, meanwhile, sent Eri Jabotinsky to Turkey in the spring of 1944 to work with War Refugee Board
    emissaries there. Through frenetic lobbying of Turkish government
    officials, Jabotinsky helped open escape routes for Jews to get out of
    Greece and Rumania, and built relationships with the array of boat
    owners and black marketeers, willing to undertake what the author and Bergson Group
    activist John Gunther called “Jew-running.” By early 1945, however,
    Jabotinsky was forced to flee Turkey just ahead of a British arrest
    warrant related to his ties to the Irgun. Historians estimate that
    altogether, the War Refugee Board’s efforts played a major role in saving about 200,000 Jews and 20,000 non-Jews.

  62. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 4:26 PM

    Among the activities of the
    Vaad Hatzalah was a march
    of several hundred rabbis on
    Washington, in order to pressure
    the American government to help
    save lives from the genocide of
    the Holocaust. Historian Berel
    Wein notes that the "Rabbis'
    March on Washington" was
    undertaken by the rabbinical
    organization, Agudas
    Harabonim (which was part of
    Vaad Hatzalah), together
    with another activist group:
    The Emergency Committee to Save
    the Jewish People of Europe
    ("Triumph of Survival"). The
    Emergency Committee was
    established by Hillel Kook, a
    young Zionist activist from
    Jerusalem who was critical of
    the Zionist establishment for
    not making rescue work during
    the Holocaust a major priority.
    He was a skilled activist who
    developed creative ways to
    publicize the genocide in
    Europe, as well as the Allies’
    failure to respond. The march of
    the rabbis on Washington was his
    idea, and it gained the support
    of leading Torah sages. (In his
    rescue work, Hillel Kook used
    the pseudonym, Peter H.

  63. So you are claiming that Rav Aharon acknowledged the superior wisdom of Kook and only because of this he succeeded in saving Jews? Nonsense!

  64. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 5:24 PM

    it helped him in doing this -
    You are on a see-saw between Rav Aharaon and Reb Elchonon, or the arguments they gave, which were total opposites.

    So when you swing to the Elchononist view , the people like Bergson-Kook are doin aveiros in saving jewish lives, because they are destroying their souls. On the other hand, if you accept the Aharonist view, that saving lives is a chiyuv, even if it means desecrating shabbes, then of course you want full credit for the Gadol hador, and not for modernised activists like Peter /Hillel Kook.

  65. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 5:35 PM

    the issue is whether someone who has expertise in secular matters can give advice to a Rav or Posek.
    As I mentioned, Rambam in Hilchos Shabbat states that we must ask a physician if there is sakkanah, in whcih case it overrides shabbes, and other mitzvos. Not a majority of doctors, even a single opinion. I then argued that this would apply in other areas outside of medicine.
    You can't be both totally divorced from secular affairs, and at the same time an expert on all secular knowledge!

  66. Wow and he moved to America because he knew better than anyone else - especially chareidim - what was going to happen - utter nonsense!

  67. Nonsense there was not agreement of secular authorities in this matter

  68. You are making up nonsensical explanations

  69. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 7:48 PM

    exactly - rambam says you don't need agreement, a single doctor who says there is sakanah is listened to, and acted upon

  70. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 7:51 PM

    Many others fled, Germany especially, most of the jews fled, becasue they could see the writing the wall.

  71. Kalonymus HaQatanJune 1, 2022 at 9:20 PM

    They are very sensible you're trying to have your cake and eat it and not say mezonos.

    If it is bad to go to America why did Rabbi kotler go.?

    If Rabbi Cotler was right then why you defending rabbi wasserman?

  72. It's a phrase. Meaning the advent of Nazi brutality was already a warning sign in the 30s, and they could see where this was heading.

  73. So you have a question which is not a proof to anything you have stated

  74. Yes, The question is what I wished to make clearer.

    But it is similar to the previous poitn I made - if 3 gedolim of the stature of Rav Shkop, Rav Polachek and rav Moshe Soloveitchik were Teachers and Roshei Yeshiva at YU/RIETS, l'chatchila, under Dr Revel, then again, the objections of Rav Elchonon H'YD were not clear cut, and certainly not too convincing when under shmad and oness.

  75. hil. melachim ch 5:


    It is permitted to dwell anywhere in the entire world with the

    exception of the land of Egypt. Its territory includes a square of 400 parsah by 400 parsah

    from the Mediterranean Sea proceeding westward, bordering on the land

    of Kush and the desert. It is forbidden to dwell in this entire


    In three places, the Torah warned against returning to Egypt:

    a) 'God has told you, you must never again return on that path' (Deuteronomy 17:16);

    b) 'You shall not see it again' (Deuteronomy 28:68);

    c) 'You shall never see them again forever' (Exodus 14:13).

    Alexandria is included in this prohibition.


    It is permitted to return to Egypt for the purpose of trade and
    commerce and to pass through while conquering other nations. The
    prohibition consists of settling there.

    Lashes are not given as punishment for the violation of this
    prohibition because at the time one enters, there is no prohibition.
    Should he decide to settle there, there is no deed involved.

    It appears to me that if a king of Israel would conquer the land of
    Egypt with the approval of the court, it would be permissible to settle
    there. The prohibition against returning was only given to individuals
    or to dwell there while it is under the rule of the gentiles for their
    behavior is more depraved than that of the peoples of other lands as can
    be inferred from Leviticus 18:3: 'Do not follow the ways of Egypt...

    Rambam permits dwelling there for trade or commerce.

    Why would he forbid America when he already permits it?


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