Protest in New Square

Joseph's recapitulation of Tropper scandal

DT said:
Perhaps a new perspective is needed. Are you willing?

Joseph said:

I have thought about this and have also looked into all your previous posts, you have really left no stone unturned. In the beginning you even posted a defense for tropper, there was no real response. You asked tropper to apologize to reduce the chilul hashem in the world, there was no response. You posted a wonderful post; "Sounds of silence or who is the 800 lb gorilla in the room?" that post couldn't have been written better, you write there that tropper seems to have some friends still defending him, which sounds absurd. You write that the tapes have been 100% clarified. You quoted in a new post Rav Sternbuch, which is common sense, there is nothing more to be written in my opinion.

This last post of yours has drawn almost 100 responses, more than ever,(I don't know why this one triggered people more than previous ones) but a lot of it is going round in circles with the defenders constantly puling the wool over everyone's eyes. Like someone wrote before, if the holocaust can be denied then so can troppers guilt. Maybe you add this to the list of conspiracy theories, that you once posted. Its similar to the tactics that Hitler YMSH used in the early 1930`s, i.e. if you say a lie enough times then it becomes the truth. (this is the power he used to convince the german people of all his dirty theories and plans) This tactic is being deployed here and is becoming more widespread as the time goes on, obviously they are hoping to have some results via this method.

I would therefore advise you not to lend a hand to this dirty trick, keep yourself clean and above the water. Eventually the truth will prevail, as it always does, this took some years of your fighting to reveal this menuval, but now the truth is really out for everyone to see and hear.

Rav Sternbuch:Tropper is guilty!

There are increasing comments popping up that there is no evidence against Tropper. That the tapes are forged or misunderstood.

Let me present something rather basic that Rav Sternbuch has said recently to someone who asked about Tropper's guilt.

Rav Sternbuch, shlita said the following:

The fact that this story with the accompanying accusations has been printed in newspapers  around the world, the normal thing would be to hire the best lawyer in the world and issue a public denial and sue all the papers for libel. The mere fact that this has not been done is the biggest proof the accusations are true. It is an example of what our Sages say that silence in the face of an accusation is understood to be an admission "Shetikah k'hodah".

Messianic Times & rabbinic immorality

סוטה מט:

אזלא ודלדלה, ואין שואל ואין מבקש, על מי יש להשען? על אבינו שבשמים. בעקבות משיחא - חוצפא יסגא, ויוקר יאמיר, הגפן תתן פריה והיין ביוקר, ומלכות תהפך למינות, ואין תוכחת, בית וועד יהיה לזנות, והגליל יחרב, והגבלן ישום, ואנשי הגבול יסובבו מעיר לעיר ולא יחוננו, וחכמות סופרים תסרח, ויראי חטא ימאסו, והאמת תהא נעדרת, נערים פני זקנים ילבינו, זקנים יעמדו מפני קטנים, בן מנוול אב, בת קמה באמה, כלה בחמותה, אויבי איש אנשי ביתו, פני הדור כפני הכלב, הבן אינו מתבייש מאביו, ועל מה יש לנו להשען? על אבינו שבשמים

רש"י מסכת סוטה דף מט עמוד ב

ובית הוועד - של חכמים יהיו לבית זנות שכלו החכמים ואין לומד תורה ויהא חרב מאין איש ובעלי זימה מתגודדים שם מפני שחוץ לעיר היו בתי מדרשות שלהם.

Sotah (49b) BECAME MORE AND MORE DEBASED; AND THERE WAS NONE TO ASK, NONE TO INQUIRE. UPON WHOM IS IT FOR US TO RELY? UPON OUR FATHER WHO IS IN HEAVEN. IN THE FOOTSTEPS OF THE MESSIAH1 INSOLENCE WILL INCREASE AND HONOUR DWINDLE;2 THE VINE WILL YIELD ITS FRUIT [ABUNDANTLY] BUT WINE WILL BE DEAR;3 THE GOVERNMENT WILL TURN TO HERESY4 AND THERE WILL BE NONE [TO OFFER THEM] REPROOF; THE MEETING-PLACE [OF SCHOLARS] WILL BE USED FOR IMMORALITY; GALILEE WILL BE DESTROYED, GABLAN5 DESOLATED, AND THE DWELLERS ON THE FRONTIER WILL GO ABOUT [BEGGING] FROM PLACE TO PLACE WITHOUT ANYONE TO TAKE PITY ON THEM; THE WISDOM OF THE LEARNED6 WILL DEGENERATE, FEARERS OF SIN WILL BE DESPISED, AND THE TRUTH WILL BE LACKING; YOUTHS WILL PUT OLD MEN TO SHAME, THE OLD WILL STAND UP IN THE PRESENCE OF THE YOUNG, A SON WILL REVILE HIS FATHER, A DAUGHTER WILL RISE AGAINST HER MOTHER, A DAUGHTER-IN-LAW AGAINST HER MOTHER-IN-LAW, AND A MAN'S ENEMIES WILL BE THE MEMBERS OF HIS HOUSEHOLD;7 THE FACE OF THE GENERATION WILL BE LIKE THE FACE OF A DOG,8 A SON WILL NOT FEEL ASHAMED BEFORE HIS FATHER. SO UPON WHOM IS IT FOR US TO RELY? UPON OUR FATHER WHO IS IN HEAVEN.

Sounds of silence or who is the 800 lb gorilla in the room?

One of the incredible things about this whole scandal is how it has morphed into a nightmare that few understand what is ordinary sickness and what are cancerous cells that have taken over the identity of healthy cells. Who is simply lying and who are the double agents who are disseminating false information. In addition should we be concerned about what happened - a disgusting sex and bribery scandal of a sick individual or the corruption of the rabbinical elite which threatens the foundation concept of orthodoxy - emunas chachomim, Or should we be obsessing primarily over the atom bomb which was tossed in the issue of geirus and Jewish identity? Alternatively should we worry about the glee of triumph of Guma Aguiar or the despair and disappointment of Tom Kaplan?

There are things which should be obvious at this point but they are not 1) the tapes are valid. They were not fabricated or synthesized. Despite this obvious fact, there are major players in this drama who still insist that the recordings are false - synthesized by a billionaire who has access to the best experts in the world. I recently took down a post which I realized was a plant by the defenders of Tropper - that insisted that the tapes are forgeries. 2) there are hundreds of people who benefited from Tropper - who were engaged in the most disgusting chanifah - who now step over this broken man lying in the gutter while holding their noses - refusing to even acknowledge him or even mentioning that they knew him.

These people must stop ignoring him and there past association - as if nothing happened except a little rain.

WHERE ARE THE SCREAMS OF MORAL OUTRAGE FROM OUR RABBINICAL LEADERS?

WHY IS EJF GIVEN A FREE PASS TO CONTINUE PAYING OUT LARGE SUMS THAT CORRUPT OUR RELIGOUS COMMUNITY - WITHOUT ANY REVIEW OR OVERSIGHT?

WHY IS THE GREATEST CHILLUL HASHEM OF OUR TIMES IGNORED AND THOSE WHO MENTION IT ARE SILENCED?

Shulchan Aruch: Principle of self-defense & beating others to stop sin

Shulchan Aruch(C.M. 421:13): Two people who are beating each other… if one started the fight then the victim has to the right to hit the assailant in order to save himself. This principle of self defense applies also to harassment and abuse…If Reuven hit Shimon and Shimon hit Reuven in return and then the wife of Reuven came and grabbed Shimon and he removed her hand from him and hit her – Shimon is exempt. (Look at C.M. 424 when a husband and wife are hitting each other.). However it has to be evaluated when Shimon could have saved himself from Reuven’s wife with a small beating because if he used excessive force he is obligated. (This question is only in regarded to paying the four types of payment because Shimon has the status of hitting her inadvertently. However Shimon is exempt from paying for shame because he did not intent to embarrass her. Therefore if someone hit another person and the victim responded by calling the assailant a mamzer he is exempt as it says in Devarim 19:6). Similarly if someone called another person a thief and the victim responded by saying you lie like a mamzer or calls him a mamzer he is exempt for that reason) Similarly the halacha is that a man who see another Jew hitting someone and he is not able to save the victim without hitting the assailant – he is permitted to hit the assailant in order to stop him from sinning. Rema This right to hit someone to stop them from sinning also applies for anyone under your control that you see is sinning. It is permitted to hit him and chastise him to stop him from sinning and it is not necessary to get permission from a beis din. (Terumas HaDeshen #218).

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שולחן ערוך (חושן משפט תכא:יג):  שנים שחבלו זה בזה, ... אבל אם התחיל האחד, השני פטור, שיש לו רשות לשני לחבול בו כדי להציל עצמו. וכן הוא לענין גידופים וביושים, המתחיל פורע הקנס (הגהות מרדכי דקידושין). ראובן שהכה לשמעון, וחזר שמעון ובא להכותו לראובן, ובאתה אשתו של ראובן והחזיקה בשמעון, והוא נתק ידיו והכה אותה, פטור (מהרי"ו סימן כ"ח). (וע"ל סוף סימן תכ"ד איש ואשה שחבלו זה בזה). ומיהו צריך אומד אם היה יכול להציל עצמו בחבלה מועטת וחבל בו הרבה, חייב. (ודוקא לענין חבלה שמשלם לו ד' דברים, דהוי כאדם המזיק בשוגג; אבל פטור על הבושת, דהא לא כיון לבייש. ולכן המכה חבירו, וחבירו קראו ממזר, פטור, שנאמר: והיה כי יחם לבבו וגו' (דברים יט:ו). וכן אם אחד קרא לחבירו גנב, והוא אומר לו: אתה מכזב כממזר, או קראו ממזר, פטור מהאי טעמא) (מהרי"ו סימן כ"ח וסימן ס'). וכן הדין באדם הרואה אחד מישראל מכה חבירו, ואינו יכול להצילו אם לא שיכה המכה, יכול להכותו, כדי לאפרושי מאיסורא. הגה: וכן מי שהוא תחת רשותו, ורואה בו שהוא עושה דבר עבירה, רשאי להכותו ולייסרו כדי להפרישו מאיסור, ואין צריך להביאו לבית דין (ת"ה סי' י"ח /רי"ח/).

M. Freund calls for outreach to bnei anusim

JPost

For Miquel Segura of Palma de Mallorca, Spain, the journey home took more than 500 years. Last week, at a moving ceremony in Manhattan, the 65-year-old journalist and political commentator completed his return to the Jewish people, closing a circle dating back to the 14th century.

Segura is from the Chueta community, as descendants of Mallorcan Jews forcibly converted to Christianity more than five centuries ago are known.

Though the term is derogatory, with some historians suggesting it comes from the Catalan word for "pig," Segura has long worn it with unadorned pride [...]

Tropper - what's behind the silence?

[I had taken this down because it sounded like a plant but others claim it is from a perplexed person who wants this issue thoroughly discussed - therefore I am reposting it]

Dear Rabbi Eidensohn,

I heard from someone who is very close to Rabbi Tropper and who spoke to Rabbi Tropper recently that the person who authenticated the Gilad Shalit tapes told Rabbi Tropper that the tapes were "arts and crafts." Additionally, the woman involved was previously in some kind of relationship with Guma and was prepared to testify for Rabbi Tropper in the lawsuit, and that this may explain the mention of payment to lawyers on the tapes.

I personally don't think that explains the complete lack of public denial, which is damning and which, as far I can tell, serves no legal purpose. This person close to Rabbi Tropper obviously has strong reasons to want to believe in Rabbi Tropper's innocence. However, regardless of one's views of Rabbi Tropper's hashakofos, personality and ego, I do think it is important to allow for the possibility that things may not be entirely as they seem from the tapes

anonymous

P.S. Since you seem to sometimes post emails as they come in, as a courtesy to the person close to Rabbi Tropper, please don't post my name or email address. This is not an anonymous attempt to start spreading pro-Tropper rumors. I have no connection to Rabbi Tropper or his supposed attorney. In fact, I had one telephone conversation with Rabbi Tropper a few months ago and was far from impressed. I'm emailing you specifically because I think you have integrity, unlike the hordes of disenchanted Jewish bloggers who are looking for spikes in the traffic to their blogs.

Rav Sternbuch: Yosef & the art of forgetting

Rav Sternbuch: Chanukah - the Eternal Flame

Beseiged in Miami by Israeli schnorrers

Reuven writes:

I read your website, blog daily; I agree and disagree on a few issues. However a point I would like to bring across and get your response. I live in a frum community in Miami Florida, with many shuls and Jewish days’ schools. I get knocks on my doors daily even at 10 pm, people from Eretz Yisroel

They all have a sob story, how life is, and how its the American Jew who's going to bail them out, and must give needed funds now! Why is it this way? The Chutzpa, arrogant is more the word, and the disrespect they give when you give them a few dollars, they want a check!

You have a Medina called Israel which doesn't support big Frum Haimisher families and who's responsible?? They don't work, don't learn torah in kollel! They can't go into the Army, Hester programs are too Zionist for them, and so do what?? Ten percent of frum yidden belong in kollel, though who are serious about being the teacher, rabbonim, dayanim in the next generation, the rest need to get a job. To survive in today’s world you can go to a frum college, which I went to Touro College, without the distractions of the world, with 6 kids at home between 5-10 pm for 3 years after a days work. The Shulchan Urach clearly states, hilchous Talmud Torah to teach ones child a trade. Get a decent job support your family and do something meaningful in life! Being a professional shnorra isn't a profession, you are bogging down the true people in this world who need help from our fellow yidden!  When will the Haimsher, Frum, Charidim world wake up and earn a parnosha from Hashem like a mentch?

I would like to see some feed back from your blogger, thank you

European rabbis object to EJF move into Europe

JCcom

Two weeks ago, the Conference of European Rabbis (CER) passed a unanimous resolution at a meeting of its Standing Committee, in Moscow, objecting to EJF's attempts to establish itself in Europe.

It had "strong reservations" about the EJF's attempts to organise local conferences and activities by a new EJF office in Amsterdam were "not welcome".[...]

Haaretz:Tropper scandal embarrasses charedi system

Haaretz

It is hard to imagine a more embarrassing situation in which to find an exclusive ultra-Orthodox organization - a group that was a standard-bearer in the fight against "breaches in the wall of conversion" and "the penetration of complete gentiles into the vineyard of Israel."

These breaches pale into insignificance in comparison with the accusations against the man who heads the organization itself: according to the claims, Rabbi Leib Tropper of Rockland County abandoned the apparently stringent Halakhic standards of his Haredi organization and established a conversion process based on his most private impulses. [...]

Jewish Star: Tropper scandal affects conversions

Jewish Star

With the public revelation of Orthodox conversion guru Rabbi Leib Tropper as a caught-on-tape predator, the Orthodox Jewish community is grappling with a sexual scandal of Madoffian proportion.[...]