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| Rabbi Topolosky of Hebrew Academy |
I often get asked what can be done to protect ourselves from the apparent confluence of Modern Orthodoxy and Open Orthodoxy.
My answer is "Hava Nis'chakma", we must be proactive. We cannot wait till the next divisive divorce leads to hordes of ORA protestors arriving to harass a husband.
About two years ago there was an ORA protest in Washington DC. A local Orthodox day school gave some of the older students an opportunity to join the protest. I approached some of the students. This dismayed a top administrator who chaperoned the students. But I think he didn't do much to actually stop me because of a concern that his actions to muzzle me would have been perceived by the students to be hypocritical. "This school which teaches us to taste knowledge from many areas of study and trusts us to evaluate this knowledge now tells us not to listen to Joe Orlow?" Furthermore, making me forbidden fruit could possibly make my "illicit" teachings all the more attractive.
In truth, my appetite was whetted. These students asked me tough questions and paid close attention when I filled them in on the circumstances leading up to the wife demanding a Get. I realized that reaching out to students is the way to take the wind out of Open Orthodoxy's sails.
In the next phase, I would like to reach out to my friends gathered under the Daas Torah tent. Help me put together a campaign against Open Orthodoxy. Here is my idea. I seek and value your feedback.
1. I will contact the BDA explaining that the BDA's recent behavior of issuing a summons to a non-existent husband raises serious and substantial questions about the Halachic status of the BDA. Furthermore, the apparent failure of the BDA to publicly admit the BDA's wrongdoing, and the failure to explain how the BDA is going to ensure this doesn't happen again, should lead all thinking people to distance themselves from the BDA.
2. I will contact the administrators and teachers at the local Orthodox day school and tell them I will be reaching out to their students to warn their students not to use the BDA. In particular, boys and girls will be warned not to specify the BDA as their Bais Din if and when they sign any pre-nuptials.
3. I will contact students directly, teaching them the Halachic dangers inherent in the BDA pre-nuptials. I will teach them about the Halachos of when and how a Get may be forced, and when it may not be forced. I will include much of the information about the Halachos of Gittin which I've learned on this blog, and from taking Rabbi Dovid Eidensohn's ongoing telephone classes.
So, you've heard from me. I await your comments. Moe? Kishkeyum? Now is not the time for kid gloves. You've given it to me straight before; I expect nothing less here. I may only get one real chance to reach out to the young people in my town. I may not be the right one to be doing this, but at least I want to give it my best shot.
Joe Orlow
Joe,
ReplyDeleteIn this day and age, you have hope for the world? You are my inspiration.
The biggest threat to those spouting "sheker" is the informed layman, who also educates other laymen. This breaks their monopoly; which is dependent on the ignorance of the masses. We need the proverbial child who proclaims, to one and all, that the emperor has no clothes!
ReplyDeleteBracha VeHatzlacha!
I'm certainly in favor of calling the BDA to account for their practices, in the hope that this will spur them to improve. I cannot say I'm in favor of undermining the BDA. The situation with batei din nowadays is dire. The existence of the BDA provides an option for those who wish to avoid the cronyism and unfarirness that is present in so many of the more right-wing batei din.
ReplyDelete@kishkeyum: What kind of cronyism and unfairness, specifically, do you speak of, and which right-wing batei din do you refer to? Are you suggesting that the more left-wing batei din, such as the BDA, are more prone to follow halacha than the right-wing?
ReplyDeleteYes, I have hope. Some people seem to put their heart and soul into a job. They toil long hours at the job, and do the job well. But in reality, their interest in the job is to make money. If the job didn't pay, they wouldn't have anything to do with it.
ReplyDeleteThese people usually have something else in their life that is of paramount importance to them. It could be as sublime as their family, or as mundane as sports. But it's not their job.
I say this because we must not be fooled into thinking that all people who spend hours of their days, and years of their lives, studying and keeping the Torah, are necessarily that invested in the Torah. Even a cursory perusal of this blog brings this point home. Over and over we learn about men and women who step way out of line, people who have some learning and a modicum of fear of Heaven. What seems to be lacking to a great degree is the feeling. Their heart is into something else. Sometimes that something else is not a good thing.
If we pull the plug on the pleasure, these people can turn around. If we make the price for the pleasure too high, they may feel it's not worth it to pursue the pleasure. In the case at hand, we are dealing with people who are bent on promoting Modern/Open Orthodoxy uber alles, whose pleasure is to tear down the Torah.
As much as I hate doing this, my weapon of choice in challenging Modern/Open Orthodoxy (MOO) is to be obnoxious in an obsequious way.
I think Rabbi Weiss and his ilk perceived a historical opening to pursue the MOO agenda. The money was there for him and others to harvest: money from people who have a vested interest in promoting MOO, people such as those who were formerly affiliated with Conservative Judaism and and now had descendants that were not Halachically Jewish. Some of these people migrated to Orthodoxy as Conservative and Reform Judaism shrunk and crumbled. They have money they are willing to use to support institutions like Yeshivat Chovevei Torah. A similar point can be made for some people who identified all along as Orthodox but now have children openly identifying as "gay". The children have "partners" and the parents want their children to be fully accepted in the Orthodox community. Furthermore, consider that "gay" members of Shuls are not generally saddled with paying $20,000/year or more for day school tuitions. They thus sometimes have disposable income and the time that can be used to influence their Shul into hiring Yeshivat Chovevei Torah and Yeshivat Maharat graduates.
Our goal is simple. Communicate to those embracing MOO that they are vulnerable. They've trained their children to be smart and inquisitive and we are going to engage the kids in Torah discussions. The MOO don't have the stomach to fight me for the soul of their descendants. They find me repulsive, and scurry away from me.
My hope is to have the strength to keep this up long enough that the MOO find something else to do with their moola.
Point taken, and I will scale back what I said in regard to encouraging people to disconnect completely from the BDA.
ReplyDeleteWell put, and I will try to incorporate this idea into my letter to the BDA. I will post the draft of the letter here in the comments section before sending it.
ReplyDeleteThank you!
ReplyDeleteGood point. We need to enforce halachic due process in all batei din, regardless of where these are alleged to fall in the religous spectrum, and disband or at least caution against those who won't comply.
ReplyDeleteI am of the opinion that the BDA should be avoided at all costs. The problems are deep seated and built into their process. They will not uphold halacha when the popular zeitgeist deems halacha too patriarchal and too old fashioned for the 21st century.
ReplyDeleteThe BDA, ORA and Agunah
ReplyDeleteInternational are in danger, Heaven forbid, of tearing down American Judaism.
Kethuboth 105a-b:
Our
Rabbis taught: “You shall not judge unfairly: you shall show no partiality; you
shall not take bribes, for bribes blind the eyes of the discerning” (Deuteronomy
16:19) and much more so those of the foolish; “and upset the plea of the just”
(Deuteronomy 16:19) and much more so those of the wicked. Are then fools and
wicked men capable of acting as judges? But it is this that is meant: “for
bribes blind the eyes of the discerning” even a great Sage who takes bribes
will not depart from the world without [the affliction of] a dullness of the
mind, “and upset the plea of the just” even one who is righteous in every
respect and takes bribes will not depart from this world without [the affliction
of] confusion of mind. When R. Dimi came [from Palestine to Babylon] he related
that R. Nahman b. Kohen made the following exposition: What was meant by the
Scriptural text, “By justice a king sustains the land, But a fraudulent man
tears it down” (Proverbs 29:4)? If the judge is like a king who is not in need
of anything [he is independent of other people's help or favors] he “sustains the
land”, but if he is like a priest who moves to and fro among the threshing
floors [collecting terumah], he “tears it down.”
Malbim Proverbs 29:4: “A king’s
function has always been to establish social justice in the land, while of yore
the high priest was always in charge of the religious life of the nation and
the people. Even if a king functions
properly, but a high priest and his underlings are interested only in terumah,
the gifts due them by Torah law, not caring a bit for the people’s religious
life, they can tear down everything the king builds up. Without a sound structure
of worship, study and faith, the best Jewish social system is unstable.”
The BDA, ORA and Agunah International have a focus “obtaining
Jewish divorces, confirming personal status and adjudicating commercial
disputes stemming from divorce, business and community issues.” This is not the focus the Torah orders: “You
shall appoint magistrates and officials for your tribes, in all the settlements
that the Lord your God is giving you, and they shall govern the people with due
justice. You shall not judge unfairly: you shall show no partiality; you shall
not take bribes, for bribes blind the eyes of the discerning and upset the plea
of the just. Justice, justice shall you pursue, thrive and occupy the land that
the Lord your God is giving you.” (Deuteronomy 16:18-20).
Right now a great miracle has just happened in Israel that puts HUGE stops in front of the Secular, Reform, Conservative, Modern Orthodox agendas:
ReplyDeleteThe new government in Israel includes the Charedim and not just that, it is perhaps, in some way, dominated by the Charedim regarding all serious Halachic issues, so at least the agendas of the Secular, Reform, Conservative, Modern Orthodox in both Israel and outside of it are at a cross-roads. No doubt they are taking stock how to proceed and go on the attack, but for now the great miracle of Charedi Ministers and politicians in the Israel Knesset has raised the capacity of the important and powerful rabbis on the various Moatzos to influence events.
So sure, feel free to take out your pea-shooter and fire random shots at the big bad wolves, but for now a huge battle was won in Israel by the Torah side and soon we will see this actualized as they confront the false conversions, fake feminism, futile activism and destructive ploys of the Secular, Reform, Conservative, Modern Orthodox in both Israel and outside of it.
Draft of Letter to the BDA
ReplyDeleteDear Rabbi Schwartz,
I am contacting you in your capacity as Av Bais Din of the Rabbinical Council of America.
Recently, it was revealed through Federal court documents and reported widely in the press that the BDA inadvertently and unwittingly played a supporting role in an FBI sting operation. Whether or not these documents and reports are true is irrelevant here. The perception by many is that they are true enough to take them under consideration, and the apparent silence of the BDA on the matter buttresses the impression that they may be true.
I'm sure you are aware of the matter, but I will briefly summarize the salient point. The BDA issued Hazmanos, and subsequently a Seruv, against a man they thought existed. But the man did not exist.
Another Bais Din run by Rabbi Mordechai Wolmark did something similar. Rabbi Wolmark took it a step further. He ordered the non-existent man to give a Get.
I don't think Rabbi Wolmark will do something like that again. He's going to jail for several years. I don't think anyone else in America will do something like that again, either -- at least not any time soon.
But what about twenty five years from now? Could someone who is a student now in a school be thinking: Rabbi Wolmark was right in what he did. Legendary men such as Rabbi Yitzchak Breitowitz and Nathan Lewin, Esq. defended the legitimacy of Rabbi Wolmark's Bais Din. The BDA was silent. Does that not indicate the BDA acquiesced to what Rabbi Wolmark did? Enough time has gone by. Maybe I will set up a Bais Din that follows in the footsteps of Rabbi Wolmark and of the BDA and help women by issuing Seruvim against men without investigating too closely.
My intention is to reach out to young people today and warn them: when you are older and become a Dayan, do not act like what the BDA did. The BDA made a serious mistake. The silence of the BDA is not a sign that the BDA was right. The silence is likely a sign that the BDA is ashamed.
Among those I discuss this with, one says I should go further and tell the students to avoid the BDA. He holds the BDA should be abolished because it has apparently become a reed that bends with the winds of social justice. Another says that the BDA would be well served by some internal reforms and that it would be a loss to dismantle the BDA because the BDA is far better than some alternatives out there.
I think all of us would value a dialog with the BDA. I look forward to your response to this letter. Please allow me to publicly share any response you give, so that we can transparently and collectively discuss among ourselves how we can best teach students. I hope it is alright to request your help to understand better how the BDA summons people, as well as non-people, to a Bais Din. If not for my sake, please answer for the sake of those students who deserve to know what happened so that they not be mislead into repeating the mistakes of a previous generation.
Not a bad letter at all, but there are people who can even create non-existent Batei Din, such as happened in the Yoel Weiss case, when Uziel Frankel eveidently has made a career of creating Batei Din out thin air over the years using all sorts of dubious, shadowy and deceiving sounding and looking Halachic and general legalese, in sum full court press use of navel birshus HaTorah with all the bells and whistles and trimmings in order to force either wives or husbands to answer to fake hazmonas, seruvim, and whatnot.
ReplyDeleteThen what about Batei Din that are and can be bought off, as tranpired during the EJF fiasco when Batie Din were induced to enroll in dubious and shady conversion procedures, until it was denounced by the late Rabbi Abba Dunner of London who worked for real Batei Din.
What about the Batei Din of Rav Drukman that was attacked by the rulings of Rav Sherman years ago for promoting mass conversions of Israelis who are not Halachic Jews? The list goes on and on of Batei Din with problems.
What about Batei Din that accept the shaky arguments of aggressive and pushy Toanim and will fight not for victims but to get abusers off the hook? The list of imperfect Batie Din is endless!
What about Batei Din, like that of many Chasidic groups that will not accept the rulings and standards of non-Chasidic Batei Din whether for Hechesherim or Geirus? Batei Din looking down on other Batei Din is not news, it's been around for millennia.
Going back in time, what about the Batei Din of Vilna that put into Cherem the Chasidim, and then the Batei Din of the Chasidim that returned the favor? Should one now start a process of deligitimizing any Bais Din that does not match out own personal Hashkofa?
Then you can start knocking down the Rabbanut's Batei Din and prefer to use only the BADATZ, or knock down any Bais Din that has a Kippa Seruga rabbi on it, and only accept a Bais Din whose Dayanim wear black coats and have long beards and obvious Peyos!
All Batei Din are imperfect in some way and it easy to find faults with any of them. A Bais Din is not fallible and it can make errors, as seems to be the case with the BDA, but to throw out the baby with bathwater is not a good idea because the people who rely on the BDA at least, will not become overnight supporters of the full Charedi agenda no matter how right it may be or seem.
So Joe, your righteous indignation is well-taken, but have you really considered the consequences of your moves and how it will all play out if all the pieces are considered?
Hey, if you want to put your trust in the "new government", go for it. For now, I'll stick with doing what is in my power to do. Thanks for the feedback.
ReplyDeleteThis is a well written letter. Thank you for your efforts.
ReplyDeleteIs there any way to get the media in on this. If there is a way, is it a route that is also worthwhile pursuing?
Hi Raps. I ask my students who attend public school what the unofficial rule of America is. They generally figure it out quickly based on their immersion in the American culture: do whatever you feel like as long as you don't harm anyone else along the way. This leads to a discussion how the Torah construes this type of freedom as a form of slavery to desire.
ReplyDeleteMy interest in contacting Rabbi Schwartz is not to judge the judges. My Rabbis teach me aspects of the Halacha that is different than how Rabbi Schwartz and his Bais Din apparently understand Halacha. The BDA, however, does not have to answer to me. They are, after all, the Beth Din of America -- America, where anything goes.
My interest stems from the fact that the BDA is getting very close to crossing a red line where their actions could potentially impact me, to my detriment. Someone could arbitrarily claim I won't give a Get, the BDA could sign off on that, and some bogus Bais Din could decide to act on that.
Some readers may be aware of a turf war among outlaw motorcycle gangs which recently came to a head in Waco, Texas. If some thug agents of a rogue Bais Din have a hankering to start up with me, we can settle it outside in the parking lot. My agenda is to have the other side reflect on the possible ramifications of their self-righteous indignation on behalf of Agunas, and to consider the consequences of their moves and how it will all play out if all the pieces are considered.
Joe, your heart is obviously in the right place and you deserve to be commended for your efforts, but you need to avoid hyperbole, such as making hay out the "America" that that students may know and the word "America" in the BDA! Or making comparisons between killer biker gangs and a Bais Din you find fault with.
ReplyDeleteThere is the old question of what if a gentile decides to foll a Bais Din in order to convert and it is never official uncovered, who has the "ger" fooled? Obviously himself and God, because there is that much a Bais Din can do, it is made up of fallible human beings after all and it can and does make mistakes. Some problems need to be left for God to solve His way!
So while you are right in expecting some sort of explanation, if not an apology from the BDA, but that is still not sufficient grounds to destroy them entirely. Surely you know that in Orthodoxy today there is wide spectrum of Hashkofas, and obviously the BDA is too modern for you and for many others, but advocating for women is not a "sin" and not everyone can get it right so that they do not run afoul of every last Halachic requirement in vast realms of Shulchan Oruch and Poskim.
The situation in front of us is very sad. Couples were fighting and split and it led to a war that dragged down many others. Hopefully each and every one of us who is married can strive for Sholom Bayis and making our spouses 100% happy, if that is even humanly possible, and avoid the literal Mageifa (plague) of marital discord, war of the sexes, separation and divorce with all the ugliness that comes with it.
The problem is not the BDA, or the foolish rabbis who were caught in the FBI sting, the problem is you and me and every person in a marriage that needs to be nurtured.
But too many people are just too selfish and out for their own self-gratification. We have become a nation of spoiled brat narcicists because our parents gave us everything and then when we have to give to others in a marriage we are functionally illiterate and create wars and all sorts of craziness as you see played out in front of you with even Batei Din getting dragged down in the mud.
So tone down your attacks and proceed with greater care, be more judicious and lawyerly and deal with the problem in smaller incremental ways by showing good faith and not insulting the BDA and then hope they will somehow respond to that. They are too busy and have more important things to do because, like it or not, they are a trusted and used Bais Din than many turn to. Perhaps not you and me, but we can't nuke them as if there is no tomorrow. Hope you catch my drift here.
You miss my point, right now, basically you are powerless to to do anything real. No one is forcing anyone to go to or use the BDA or do anything else. But some issues will and can only be settled by "higher powers" and in this case, there are many big things that are about to happen that will favor right wing Orthodoxy and that will diminish the power and influence and inroads of modern Orthodoxy.
ReplyDeleteThe victory of the the Israeli right wing with the Charedi and Religious Zionist parties playing a leading role means that they now have access to the levers of state power and you can rest assured that in the coming months and years we are going to see the agendas of the Secular, Reform, Conservative, Modern Orthodox in both Israel and outside rolled back.
There is a new sheriff in town on the Jewish world scene and it is going to put the breaks, if not stop in its tracks, many of the left-wing agendas. Those modern Orthodox rabbis and groups who basically promote a feminist reform of Judaism in Halacha are not going to be happy.
Keep your eye on the big picture and let it encourage you. What is happening with the the likes of the BDA is not even a tempest in a tea cup because Batei Din starting in Israel are about to be untied and allowed to implement rulings that will strengthen Torah observance. I prefer looking at the big picture rather than getting caught up in relatively minor issues. It is more interesting and it gives all of us hope at Torah Jews.
I catch your drift. You are telling me to stand down. You are telling me to be merciful.
ReplyDeleteMy reservoir of mercy is near empty, however. I have spent it on having mercy on children yet to be born, exhausting myself in fighting for women to receive valid Gittin. I am wearied from having mercy on men harassed by Batei Din who demand that the husbands "show up and give up or get beat up".
All I've got left for Batei Din is Din. Mida K'neged Mida.
But don't fret. All is not lost. I will dig deep inside my being and find some cruse of compassion.
"First they came for the embattled husbands, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not getting a divorce.
"Then they came for the non-existent husbands, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not imaginary.
"Then they came for the Halacha, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Talmud Chacham.
"Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me."
- With apologies Martin Niemöller
Nice. Let's see what response you get.
ReplyDeleteI was always curious (and actually mentioned this here a few months ago) what can stop a person (male or female) from bringing a quote spouse unquote to a bet din, request a get, and set up an appointment for next week.
ReplyDeletethe two supposed couple will come, and pay $500 (or whatever it is today) and a bottle of vodka (chabad) or single malt scotch (MO) and half an hour later, receive a ptur.
I once asked a friend of mine who is involved in gitten, and he said there is a control: state issued photo ID. well, if one of the couple is married, he / she can always get a duplicate drivers license in the real spouses name with the new spouse's picture; they are married, and he / she has access to whatever paperwork is needed for a duplicate license (let alone the problems this can cause the real spouse)
so not only is there no real control, it has been done now, in a sense, by the BDA.
Letter goes out tomorrow. Registered mail.
ReplyDeleteIn due time I hope this will be picked up by the media. One step at a time. Let's wait for the response from Rabbi Scwartz.
ReplyDelete"No one is forcing anyone to go to or use the BDA or do anything else." Someone read this post and contacted me. He is receiving summons after summons from the BDA. A Seruv from the BDA is in the works, no doubt. ORA is likely straining at the leash, salivating at the prospect of another campaign that will put cash in their coffers. Do you hear the sound of one finger pressing on a smartphone screen? Someone somewhere is on Amazon making one-click purchases of prods and bags of plastic. More "hyperbole" (as you put it) from me? Perhaps -- perhaps. But I'm not taking any chances with these clowns.
ReplyDeleteHappy hunting!
ReplyDeleteBut remember that:
"An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure"!
Good luck with trying to instill order between battling wives and husbands. Why are you involved in this? There are fights for Kashrus, fights for Kiruv, fights for Geirus, fights for Chinuch, fights to defend Israel, fights for all sorts of things, this is the worst field, the war of the sexes featuring your local Mom and Pop going at each other's throat!
ReplyDeletePlease remember that:
"Fools rush in where angels fear to tread"!
For the record
ReplyDelete(1) I wrote the letter by hand. I wanted to make the point that this letter is not off the cuff. It is not polemical. This letter is a serious communication deserving of a reply.
(2) I sent the letter via UPS. The letter required a signature for delivery. I was able to confirm that the letter has been received by the BDA.
(3) The final version had some minor changes to what I posted elsewhere in this comments section.
Thank you to all who helped me to clearly articulate the points I wanted to make in the letter, and thank you to Rabbi Eidensohn for hosting me on his blog.