Igros Moshe (Even Haezer IV #10) Should a person take a test for Tay Sachs before marriage. Question Concerning the matter of the children who by nature live only a short time after being born, about two or three years and die, which is called Tay-Sachs.They are born from a father and mother who both contribute to produce this condition. Even though neither parent has the sickness or suffers any personal consequences for being a carrier for the sickness, the consequence is that they produce children with this sickness. If only one parent is a carrier than the children don’t get the sickness. It can be determined by a blood test whether the person is a carrier or not. This knowledge of who is a carrier can aid in deciding whether a particular boy should marry a particular girl. If he is a carrier he should avoid marrying a girl who is a carrier. She should avoid marrying a boy who is a carrier if she is a carrier. You want to know my humble opinion whether it is appropriate for the boy and girl to make an effort to find out whether they are a carrier If it is a good thing to take the test, should it be done while they are still children or only when they are ready for marriage? Should it be conducted in a public manner or privately? Answer Even though only a small small minority of children are born like this and it is appropriate to say about it, Tamimim Tehiye (be innocent with the L-rd your G-d), as Rashi explains that you should walk with G-d in innocence and wait for Him and do not inquire about the future. Nevertheless since it is now easy to test, perhaps not testing should be viewed as if he is closing his eyes to see what can be seen since if something like this happened to the child, it is extremely distressing to the parents. Consequently it would be appropriate to have this test prior to marriage. Therefore it is a good idea to publicize this in newspapersand other ways so that everyone knows there is such a test buy it is clear and obvious that this should be conducted privately so that the identities of the boy and girl should not be made public even bt the doctor who does the test. Even though the doctors testify that a man or women without this genetic problem who marry someone with the genetic problem the resulting child will be healthy, however many people will not believe this to be true and therefore they won’t be able to getr married and therefore the results should not be publicized and it is best if a large group should be tested such as a whole yeshiva or school. Also because most people are nervous and regard small problems as big ones this especially true in America, therefore the test should only be done just prior involvement in getting married. In other words most people should not even be told about this before the age of twenty and girls not before the age of 18. It is also important that no pressure to have an abortion result from this
Rav Moshe is stating here that Tamim isn't violated by medical tests which easily determine information. However I was told that Rav Moshe was against medical screening tests such as pap tests when the person had no symptoms of illness. this includes yearly medical tests and x-rays as well as prostate testing. In the eighth volume of the Igros they included the story that when he had a suspected heart attack he was upset they took a series of blood tests. So not sure what his actual view was.
"However I was told that Rav Moshe was against medical screening tests such as pap tests when the person had no symptoms of illness. this includes yearly medical tests and x-rays as well as ptostate testing."
ReplyDelete1) you were told.. but that is not valid unless it is written, right?
2) Medicine has advanced quite a bit since the 70s.
3) There may be risk factors eg genetic or inherited risks. Doctors (good ones) today try to be minimally invasive.
4) It is clear that the arguments presented above, whether genuine or not, does not have a grasp of science or medicine.
There are some rare diseases - Rachmano l'etzlan, that are more prevalent in some groups eg Tay Sachs, Gaucher disease are more prevalent amongst Ashkenazi Jews. I've read even that the Karaites, because of their small gene pool, have some genetic diseases which are more prominent.
ReplyDeleteSo the risk for Ashkenasi Jews for example, is much higher unfortunately for certain genetic diseases than the general population in America or Europe.
Just because it doesn't say "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure" in the Talmud doesn't mean it isn't true.
ReplyDeleteThe principal of Tamimim is against your rule of an ounce
DeleteIt's to do with horoscopes and the occult.
DeleteRambam in Deot has a system of healthy diet and practices which he says will prevent disease. Sounds more like ounce than temimim
I've read quite a bit about this and screening for cancer is not a violation of "t'mimim" but a kiyum of "v'nishmartem"
DeleteRemember, Rav Moshe used a similar argument to not forbid smoking. That G-d protects the tam, simple.
DeleteSo my estimate is that his son in law was either not consulted, or was not able to convince him on such matters.
It's true that some medical procedures and biopsies cy cause harm, whilst some people who smoke also live long lives
perhaps not testing should be viewed as if he is closing his eyes to see what can be seen
ReplyDelete