https://halachipedia.com/index.php?title=Co-education
Rav Moshe Feinstein, one of the greatest Poskim of the 20th century wrote in a Teshuvah dated in 1954 that there is an obligation of Chinuch to separate schools between boys and girls even at a very young age; even before the children reach puberty boys and girls need to be trained to stay separate from the opposite gender. In a small Jewish community that had two options to either (a) Open a co-ed Jewish school for the boys and the girls or (b) Open a Yeshivah for boys and send the girls to a non-Jewish school Rav Moshe held that option a was better. That was the only case in which he allowed for a co-ed school. In a later Teshuvah written to the Jewish community of Scranton in the 1980s where there were only 81 Jewish children in the entire community in which case separating the boys and girls would result in having 3-5 children in each class, thereby making it extremely difficult to run a normal school, Rav Moshe held that in such a case we say עת לעשות לה' הפרו תורתך and he allowed "only the city of Scranton" to have a co-ed school. In another Teshuvah sent to R. Elya Brudny of the Mir Yeshivah in Brooklyn, NY dated in 1982, Rav Moshe clarifies his ruling (made public by his grandson R. Mordechai Tendler) that schools are obligated to separate boys from girls from the ages of 4 and 5 in order to impress upon the children's minds and hearts the importance of staying separate from the opposite gender. When asked if a school that separates from age 4 is better than a school that separates from age 5, Rav Moshe said "Not necessarily".
These Teshuvot and more on the subject are printed in Igrot Moshe Yoreh Deah 1:137, 2:104, 3:73, 3:78, 4:28.
And back when cheder was an unheated, unair conditioned shack on the edge of town and the only furnishing were a table, 2 benches and an oil lamp, you could open lots of schools and keep kids separate.
ReplyDeleteOutside of the major Jewish communities, the Scranton situation is the more common one.
In my small community, the frum kids are in the minority, the frum parents who care about separating boys and girls in the minority of those and an attempt by the school to not be co-ed would leave maybe 10 kids which isn't enough to pay the bills.
Remember the possible has to be preferred over the ideal sometimes.
a) there's a gay problem in society, and frum/hareidi world are not immune
Deleteb) Yeshivas and their heads have no clue on what to do, and they rely on the idea that learning and marrying them off will straighten them out. This is a mistake.
c) There's also a shidduch crisis. Being kept away from girls is very bad for a man's development, and can ruin his ability to form relationships with women.
OK, but in a ideal world it might still work
Where there has been co-ed has the stats been any better?We are both aware of the answer,but you are going to push your lane
DeleteDoes it need to be firmly addressed? Yes.Relevant?Hardly
Co ed has different contexts.
DeleteSo there are secular schools and universities which are co ed. There are youth groups which are mixed, eg bnei akiva. They seem to have less of a shidduch problem and also culture, ie they meet outside of the shidduch system.
From what I've read, there are drop outs in both systems. However, where they drop to is different.
DeleteBnei Akiva kids might lose some of their frumkeit. They might engage in behaviour that is definitely not appropriate. They will, however, continue to practice some halakha. The UO kids drop all the way out, drop everything and leave the community entirely.
“obligation of Chinuch to separate schools between boys and girls even at a very young age;” Daf Hayomi today Tractate Avodah Zarah 66a
ReplyDeleteדְּתַנְיָא: רַבִּי יְהוּדָה אוֹמֵר מִשּׁוּם רַבִּי מֵאִיר: מִנַּיִן לְכׇל אִיסּוּרִין שֶׁבַּתּוֹרָה שֶׁמִּצְטָרְפִין זֶה עִם זֶה? שֶׁנֶּאֱמַר: ״לֹא תֹאכַל כׇּל תּוֹעֵבָה״, כֹּל שֶׁתִּיעַבְתִּי לָךְ — הֲרֵי הוּא בְּבַל תֹּאכַל.
For it was taught in a Baraisa: R’Yehudah says in the name of R’Meir: From where (do we derive with regard) to all prohibited items that are (mentioned) in the Torah that they combine with on another? For it is stated (Deuteronomy 14:3): You shall not eat anything abhorrent (which is expounded to mean) Anything I have made abominable for you is subject to (this prohibition) not to eat. Schottenstein comments here That is, if a person eats, say, a half kezayis of kilaei hakerem with half a kezayis of orlah, he receives lashes for eat a kezayis of prohibited food.
My theory. I live in Bnei Brak, so beautiful so holy does as Rav Moshe Feinstein, one of the greatest Poskim of the 20th century wrote in a Teshuvah dated in 1954 that there is an obligation of Chinuch to separate schools between boys and girls even at a very young age; even before the children reach puberty boys and girls need to be trained to stay separate from the opposite gender.
May I tell a story? I complain against Bank Leumi. They use to put on their website a photo of 2 men in pajamas hugging each other. Terrible: Bank Leumi is supporting what God made an abomination (2 men to have sex with each other). Today Bank Leumi removed that photo of 2 men in pajamas hugging each other. Good. Today Bank Leumi offers to holders of it VISA card (I have a valid Bank Leumi Visa card) 50% discount for any purchases from abhorrent Papa Johns in Ramat Gan on Jerusalem Street near Ben Gurion Street. Terrible. Well known that Papa Johns is a big operation with many motorcycles parked in front that sells pizza pies with meat including bacon including open and delivery on Shabbas. Bank Leumi is supporting what God made an abomination (cooking cheese with meat etc). The Torah orders: (Deuteronomy 14:3): You shall not eat anything abhorrent. Yes I support separate schools between boys and girls even at a very young age.