There are a number of conflicting versions of this story circulating. But so far it would seem that there is a major halachic problem - not racisim. Furthermore these are Falash Mura who had converted to Christianity in Ethiopia, not the Beta Yisroel See also Tzitz Eliezer
JPost is reporting that Rav Ovadiya Yosef is demanding that the students be accepted.
Shas spiritual mentor Rabbi Ovadia Yosef threatened Monday to fire any school principal from Shas's school system who refused to receive Ethiopian students.
In parallel, Chief Sephardi Rabbi Shlomo Amar announced that it was forbidden to send Ethiopian students to the secular school system.
"If I was brought into this world only to help the Ethiopians that is enough for me", said Yosef on Monday morning during a meeting with Amar in his home in Jerusalem's Har Nof neighborhood, according to Amar's spokesman.
Amar's spokesman said that the chief rabbi ruled that it was forbidden to integrate the Ethiopians in secular state schools because many were Falashmura who were still in the process of converting to Judaism. [...]
However
Haaretz reports That Chief Rabbi Amar - says that they can't be accepted because of unnamed halachic reasons
Sephardi Chief Rabbi Shlomo Amar said Monday that Ethiopian students could not be accepted into religious schools in Petah Tikva because of "halakhic reasons." [...]
There are a number of conflicting versions of this story circulating.
ReplyDeleteYou are talking about the zionist press. If they ever printed something truthful, it was purely coincidental.
Before the American Civil War, there were rabbis who paskened that it was a mitzvah to have black slaves since it was the curse of Cham.
ReplyDeleteThe Leader, Garnel Ironheart said...
ReplyDeleteBefore the American Civil War, there were rabbis who paskened that it was a mitzvah to have black slaves since it was the curse of Cham.
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What relevance does that have to the current topic?
What relevance does that have to the current topic?
ReplyDeleteI'm not Garnel, but my guess would be that people can find halachic justifications for racism.
The Wolf
BrooklynWolf said...
ReplyDeleteWhat relevance does that have to the current topic?
I'm not Garnel, but my guess would be that people can find halachic justifications for racism.
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that is true and I don't think that anyone is unaware of that. But what relevance does it have to a situation which clearly involves halachic difficulties which are independent of the issue of race.
1. Of course they need to convert according to every one except rabbi O.J.
ReplyDelete2 the RADVAZ that ROJ brings says the SLAVES of bnie dan, not bnie dan .(source RABBI BERL WIEN).
Has anyone elucidated what the "halakhic reasons." are?
ReplyDeleteKT
Joel Rich
Rabbi Amar is now saying that sending the Ethiopian kids to SECULAR schools would present a halachik problem, since many of them are currently involved in a giyur lechumra process.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1251145160449&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FPrinter
Tzurah said...
ReplyDeleteRabbi Amar is now saying that sending the Ethiopian kids to SECULAR schools would present a halachik problem, since many of them are currently involved in a giyur lechumra process.
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Doesn't say that in the JPost link you provided. It says:
The spokesman said the chief rabbi ruled that it was forbidden to integrate the Ethiopians in secular state schools because many were Falashmura who were still in the process of converting to Judaism.
The Jpost article does say that (even if the exact words were not used). What do you think it means by "the chief rabbi *ruled* that it was *forbidded*"? Sounds like he has halachik considerations in mind to me.
ReplyDeleteAnyways, a www.theyeshivaworld.com article speaks it out more.
http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/General+News/38824/Halachic+Issues+Regarding+Petach+Tikvah's+Ethiopian+Students.html
"Chief Rabbi Shlomo Moshe Amar Shlita announced on Monday that he cannot support growing calls to permit the students to enter secular schools in the city since the *halachic issues* involved dictate they students continue in their religious environment."
Tzurah:
ReplyDeleteAre you sure that the conversion process in which these Ethiopians in question are involved is giyur l'chumra as opposed to out-and-out giyur stam? This distinction may be what R' Eidensohn is picking up on (am I right about this, R' Eidensohn?).
Blogger Chizki said...
ReplyDeleteTzurah:
Are you sure that the conversion process in which these Ethiopians in question are involved is giyur l'chumra as opposed to out-and-out giyur stam? This distinction may be what R' Eidensohn is picking up on (am I right about this, R' Eidensohn?).
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That is right. While Yeshiva World News described it as giyur l'chumra none of the other sources say such a thing.
Not sure why either is required according to Rav Ovadia Yosef. It is obvious why it is required by other authorities.
R' Eidensohn and Chizki,
ReplyDeleteInteresting point, but the question is on R' Amar, not me.
It is a curious situation. If you hold that they're not Jews (yet), what does it matter which school they go to? OTOH, if you hold that they're already Jewish, the kind of school they go to won't affect their Jewish status.
Also, perhaps there is confusion in the terminology b/c R' Amar (and R' Yosef) sees the process that the kids are undergoing as a giyur lechumrah, merely to help the kids with their practical integration into the larger Jewish world, while other who do not hold like them sees it a giyur stam.
I wonder what will be done at the practical level. Will these kids do tevila with a bracha or not?
Of course, there is racism in the Litvish ultra haredi circles (and some Modern Orthodox as well) toward people with darker skin.
ReplyDeletePeople still remember when Sephardic Jews were called "Franks" and "Shwartze tuches". Our own Jersey girl described in this blog her painful experience as non-Ashkenazi girl in Ashkenazi school.
the Monsey Tzadik said...
ReplyDeleteOf course, there is racism in the Litvish ultra haredi circles (and some Modern Orthodox as well) toward people with darker skin.
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I am simply questioning the automatic production of the race card everytime a problem arises. In this case despite all the hysteria and condemnation - no one has produced any evidence that the non-admission of these students is a result of racism.