Igros Moshe (Y.D. I #90): Question A boy and a girl want to get to know each other for the purpose of marriage to determine whether they will like each other. They want to know whether it is permitted to rent two separate bedrooms in one house where the owner and his wife also live. Answer It is clear that if it is known to the owner and his wife that they are not husband and wife – there is reason to be lenient. However if they have not informed then it is possible that they might mistakenly assumed that they are married and therefore it won’t help that the owner lives there. If the owner doesn’t know that they are not married it would thus be prohibited to rent the separate rooms because the owner is no longer a protection against sin because they are not embarrassed to be alone together and other similar problems. Regarding the issue of whether it is permitted for her to prepare meals for him, it seems that there is no concern that this is prohibited according to all authorities. That is because this is not included in the prohibition of utilizing a woman’s services. This type of service is permitted as is serving as a maid – even if she does it for free. All of this is permitted according to the strict letter of the law – however in actuality it is not worth doing. A person shouldn’t try to be too “smart” in these matters. It is sufficient if she finds favor in his eyes - regarding her appearance, her family and her reputation concerning her religious observance - that he can rely on that to get married with the hope that she was the one designated for him from Heaven. It is not necessary to examine her first. Furthermore this “test” is worthless to determine if she will be a good wife. Rather the Torah tells us to be “tamim” (to have simple trust) with G‑d.
I've always found this interesting. You'd think couples living together before marriage would be a sensible thing. You get to see if you get along in close quarters before making the big commitment. And if it does, then the marriage should be stable.
ReplyDeleteBut couples who live together before marriage have the same divorce rate as those that don't. It doesn't change anything.
It raises the question of what information is beneficial to ascertain before marriage?
DeleteThe question above does not sound typically yeshivish.
People are not uniformally the same either.
And frum people also have marriage breakdowns, whether resulting in divorce , agunah, or agony of continuing.
I can tell about one very great Rav whose marriage was so bad, he'd joke about it to his talmidim
It goes all the way back to the Gemara. I'm sure DT has the reference but I'm lousy with names but there was one Amora whose figured out that when he asked his wife for beans, she'd make him vegetables so the son advised him to ask for vegetables when he wanted beans. He thought it was a good idea but didn't implement it because lying would be worse.
DeleteThere's a problem with these teshuvos
ReplyDeleteThey are addressing specific questions raised by different individuals
You can't generalize from them what is appropriate behaviour for yourself or your children.
Yesterday a young man and girl are not allowed to see each other. Today they can live under one roof.
Average rabbi won't even understand what is going on.
If Fred is in a different situation, these responsa do not apply to him.