Wednesday, February 6, 2013

Vishnitz Decrees: Prohibited to walk with wife in public

BHOL  The Rebbei of Vishnitz announced a number of new decrees in a closed meeting with avreichim. They include: 1) It is prohibited to walk with his wife in public 2) It is recommended that women wear a scarf over their sheitels 3) Only Yiddish should be spoken in the house.

האדמו"ר מויז'ניץ הכריז על תקנות מחמירות במיוחד שיונהגו מעתה בחסידות. ביניהן: איסור לטייל עם האשה ברחוב ואיסור על חינמונים.

מאז שיא ימיו של האדמו"ר ה'ישועות משה' מויז'ניץ, שבחודש הקרוב ימלאו י"ב חודש להסתלקותו, לא זכור מעמד כה דרמטי, כפי שהתרחש הערב (ג), בהיכל בית המדרש הגדול בקרית ויז'ניץ בבני ברק.

התקנה הדרמטית ביותר, היא שאסור לאברך לטייל או להסתובב עם רעייתו ברחוב. איסור זה, מוכר בעיקר בחסידות גור. האדמו"ר הוסיף וציין, כי בין איש לאשתו וגם בין אדם לחברו יש להקפיד על נושאי שיחה ראויים. "לא כל נושא ראוי להעלות על השולחן ויש דברים רבים שהשתיקה יפה להן ואין לדוש בהן כלל ועיקר", הטעים.


  1. A few questions:

    a) is there any halachic basis for these decrees?

    b) Is there authority to make takkanos today, even if the majority of the peopel or community can abide by them (serious ?)

    c) What will be the knock on effects? More abuse of children? More homocentral mikvos?

    1. Of course. Communites have always made decrees. You should look at Rabbi Stepansky's four volume set published by Mosad Rav Kook on the issue of Takanaos.

      The obvious authority is if someone doesn't want to keep them he can find another community. Thus observing them is the condition for being a member in good standing.

      Perhaps the results with be positive?

    2. Now you have evidence, which might help understand complaints of people who say "Mommy is crazy, and daddy is cold".

  2. Recipients and PublicityFebruary 6, 2013 at 1:39 PM

    Ein gozrim gezeira ul hatzibur elah im kein rov tzibur yecholim la'amod bah" and in this case it is self-evidently a gezeira she'ain rov hatzibur yochol la'amod bo!

    It is "gezeira" -- actually FRUMKEIT -- overload and there should be no surprise that as in all cases of overloading circuits, mules and people, it will just collapse under its own weight. there will be more acting out, more rebelliousness, more kids going off the derech, and more lack of respect for the leadership. It's just a shame that these new rebbes have no clue, they have never experienced suffering, they just come along and impose weighty new rules off the backs of the people who barely tolerate them on sufferance and like all tiresome and burdensome over-privileged spoiled out of touch "royals" they lose the respect of their followers and will therefore be overthrown by their own folk.

  3. I saw a Vizhnitzer walking down the street today with a woman. I askied him didn't the Rebbe prohibit walking with one's wife? He answer nisht meiner!

  4. Don't worry, they'll manage fine. All these things exist in other communities.

  5. milah bchad shtikah btreiFebruary 6, 2013 at 5:08 PM

    Here we go again. Recipients and Publicity mixing his naarishkeit into issues and places he knows NOTHING about.
    Some times its best to keep quiet - even if you don't understand,

    1. Recipients and PublicityFebruary 6, 2013 at 8:25 PM

      "milah bchad shtikah btrei said...Here we go again. Recipients and Publicity mixing his naarishkeit into issues and places he knows NOTHING about. Some times its best to keep quiet - even if you don't understand,"

      Okay, can you please help us understand what is going on here. Yasher Ko'ach!

      By the way, the way the world works is that people have OPINIONS about anything they want to talk about. Not sure what world you live in. An opinion may be true, partially true/partially false or false. What do you have say instead and back it and not just "oy vey"!

      So tell us please:

      (1) Does "Ein gozrim gezeira ul hatzibur elah im kein rov tzibur yecholim la'amod bah" apply in this case ??!! Explain why.

      (2) Is it true or false that it's a "gezeira she'ain rov hatzibur yochol la'amod bo"??!! Explain why.

      Yelamdeinu rabbeinu, bevakasha!

  6. Recipients and PublicityFebruary 6, 2013 at 5:17 PM

    "koillel nick said...I saw a Vizhnitzer walking down the street today with a woman. I askied him didn't the Rebbe prohibit walking with one's wife? He answer nisht meiner!"

    For those who may not know, there are today TWO Vizhnitz Rebbes, brothers, in Bnai Brak, they recently took over and split "the kingdom [of Vizhnitz]" after their old father, the previous Vizhnitzer Rebbe passed away, so that that while one Rebbe has made a "decree" the other one has not, which only confuses matters and puts them all in a bind, how can one group be "holier than thou" than the other -- unless that is precisely the point, one brother wants to create physical demarcations on the personas to "demarcate" which are his "true" followers and which are not ! This is how Rebbes spend their time, it is often just spinning of wheels and doing anything productive while running other people's lives.

  7. It's just a recycled joke that used to apply only to Gerrer Chasidim.

  8. This leads to a revision of the old joke:

    A chosid meets another chosid and asks: "Did I see you walking down the street with your wife?"

    "No" he replies, "That wasn't my wife; it was a lady."

  9. I am just wondering whether all the chassidim have all their more basic affairs of taryag mitzvos and midos tovos in order that we are seeking to add some extra gedorim. The make such restrictions is not problematic in and of itself, but when there are other issues such as financial crimes, shalom bayis deficits, parenting problems, OTD kids, etc., one must question priorities.

  10. The walking in the street thing is weird, but its also weird in my community where young MO couples walk down the street holding hands. Sometimes.

    The scarf thing is good. Better that than $4,000 sheitels that are made to attract everyones attention.

    The real problem I have is the Yiddish only rule. Yes, teach the kids Yiddish, but you are cutting them off from doing anything other than working in the grocery store the rest of their lives... You know what? I changed my mind. Keep the Yiddish only too. Why should they have to work with goyim?

    1. What is so "kodesh" about Yiddish, seeing that it is a mamzerised version of German, ie the ashkeNazi language. When I say Ashkenaz I refer to the goy Ashkenaz named in the Torah. Yisrael are not Ashkenaz, and are not Sepharad. These 2 nations (goyim) whose languages we bastardised into our own, each were the source of Hurban, the Spanish inquisition and the german Holocaust.

    2. Well... the kids that grow up only knowing Yiddish don't learn anything outside of Yeshiva and their insular community. They have a real language barrier that keeps them completely isolated. Really. At first this looks wrong because it limits their opportunities, but with deeper reflection it isn't clear, to me, that having the opportunity to assimilate is such a good idea...

    3. @Lazer - "keeps them completely isolated":

      In that case can one assume that their ultra holy life-style of only speaking Yiddish keeps them so completely isolated and provided for, that they would never have the slightest inclination or need to apply for welfare, food stamps, Medicaid, Section 8, etc.?

      Can one also assume they would never engage in any illegal businesses, financial crimes, scams, extortion plots, operating businesses as unlicensed therapists or attorneys, etc.?

    4. Where did I say provided for?

      Its good to stay away from goyim. Its bad to commit crimes. I see your point that if I only speak Yiddish and can't earn a living then I'm bound to commit welfare fraud and other financial crimes.


  11. ולא ילך ולא יספר עם אשה בשוק "ואפילו עם אשתו" מפני טענת הבריות [אבות דרבי נתן, פ"ב]


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