Sunday, December 16, 2012

Accused former YU staff resign or placed on leave

Forward   Rabbi George Finkelstein has resigned his position at the Great Jerusalem Synagogue after the Forward reported that he had sexually abused students at Yeshiva University High School for Boys in Manhattan during the 1970s and ‘80s.

“He sent us an email saying he’s resigning because he does not want to expose the Great Synagogue to embarrassment,” Zalli Jaffe, the synagogue’s vice president, said in an interview. Finkelstein had served as the institution’s executive director since 2001; last month, he began serving as its ritual director. [...]

Around the same time as Finkelstein resigned, senior staff of the Orthodox Union in America and Jerusalem held a teleconference regarding the position of the other Y.U. high school staff member investigated by the Forward, Rabbi Macy Gordon. They decided to impose a “leave of absence” on Gordon’s teaching duties at the OU Israel Center in Jerusalem, where he gives a weekly class on the laws of the Sabbath, Tzvi Hersh Weinreb, OU executive vice president emeritus, told the Forward on December 16.

He said that the unilaterally-imposed leave of absence will last until the OU can “clarify exactly what happened.” This is in spite of the fact that the OU has “to presume that he’s innocent until we find out more about it.”

48 comments:

  1. What about Norman Lamm? Why is YU still protecting this molester-protector? Why hasn't YU yet fired Norman Lamm, the man responsible for harboring and protecting two child molesters. A man who was aware of their crimes and failed to report it to the authorities. Thus making himself an accessory to the crime and criminally liable himself. Norman Lamm allowed these two child molesters (and who even knows how many more that have yet to come to light) take jobs with children in other schools, after leaving YU, without informing their new schools or the police that they are accused child molesters.

    Norman Lamm should be immediately fired by YU, charged for his crimes and thrown into prison.

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    1. What exact crimes are you talking about? That was standard procedure in those days and it still is - even in the secular world. It would be different if he didn't fire them to protect his own students. No one claims he deliberately concealed information from other schools.

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    2. Norman Lamm was aware of the crime at the time and failed to report it to the police.

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    3. Please cite your information that the president of a private university was a mandated reporter in New York at that time.

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    4. From a post from 2011
      http://daattorah.blogspot.co.il/2011/11/new-york-mandated-reporting-laws.html

      NY has two mandated reporting laws, one in the Social Service Law; and the other in the Education Law.

      The Social Service Law lists school officials and teachers as mandated reporters of abuse. That type of abuse is limited to parent-child abuse, or guardian-child abuse.Also when I called the NYS hot line to ask whether the law means both public and private school officials and teachers, they said, yes.

      The Education Law mandated reporting statute applies to abuse inflicted by school teachers and any other employees, and is specifically limited to public schools, no question about that.
      =====================
      that means that private school officials are only required to report abuse or suspected abuse done by parents or guardians but not by school teachers or employees

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    5. Mandated school laws in New York State do not require mandated reporters to report abuse by staff members in nonpubic schools. That would mean that Rabbi Lamm was not and is not obligated to report abuse by his staff at YU. If you have sources to the contrary please let us know.
      =================================

      http://www.p12.nysed.gov/nonpub/running/qa-mandated-reporters.html

      Q. Does Section 413 of the SSL require the listed mandated reporters to report abuse or maltreatment inflicted on a child that actually has occurred on the premises of a nonpublic school, inflicted by another nonpublic school employee?


      A. In most cases, it would not. This question gets to the issue of who may be a subject of a report of suspected child abuse or maltreatment. The term “subject of the report” is defined in Section 412(4) of the SSL and includes the following: parent; guardian; other person aged 18 or older who is legally responsible for the child; director, operator, employee or volunteer in a day care program or day services program; director, operator, employee or volunteer in a home or residential facility operated or licensed by an authorized agency, the Office of Children and Family Services, the Office of Mental Health, the Office for Persons with Developmental Disabilities, or the Office of Alcoholism and Substance Abuse Services;

      director, operator, employee or volunteer of a residential educational facility; and a consultant, or employee or volunteer of a provider of goods and services to a residential care facility operated or licensed by the Office of Children and Family Services, the Office of Mental Health, the Office for Persons with Developmental Disabilities, or the Office of Alcoholism and Substance Abuse Services, or a residential educational facility.

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    6. Recipients and PublicityDecember 17, 2012 at 11:00 AM

      "Doc asked...Why hasn't YU yet fired Norman Lamm"

      What's up Doc? What are you smoking? Don't you know that Rabbi basically Lamm owns YU? Without him, there would be no YU today. He saved it from shutting down when in the 1970s Rabbi Dr. Samuel Belkin handed it over to him in total financial ruin and in a state of collapse!

      Rabbi Dr. Norman (Nochum) Lamm personally raised hundreds of millions of dollars and made YU into one of the richest universities in America today with an incredible endowment. Notch that up as another victory for a talmid of Rav Shraga Feivel Mendlowitz zt"l of Torah Vodaas that Norman Lamm attended in his youth.

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    7. Sounds like something Unorthodox Jew Would Say.You seem to be the same age as him if you know about the 70s and tout the Zeide.That would click.

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    8. Recipients and PublicityDecember 18, 2012 at 8:35 PM

      "NOSHIE63 said...Sounds like something Unorthodox Jew Would Say.You seem to be the same age as him if you know about the 70s and tout the Zeide.That would click."

      I don't know why I bother but here goes:

      Thanks for the compliments, but UOJ almost NEVER wastes his time coming on other people's blogs (as anyone who knows him would know), he would also never waste so many words to make his point, because he has has own where he posts his own stuff, and he's busy enough trying to keep up.

      But why is it something special to know about the 70s? or 80s? or about what happened 2000 years ago or in the time of World War I or WWII or what's happening now -- it just means that someone is trying to be well-informed or maybe they are just well-educated and not just opinionated with an agenda like you? It just means that the person is well-read and has studied those periods and knows some facts about them.

      Nothing dramatic to know that YU has had only four presidents since it was founded as a college-level yeshiva, and they were it's head Rosh haYeshiva: Rabbi Dr. Dov Revel, Rabbi Dr. Samuel Belkin and Rabbi Dr. Norman Lamm. Now YU has Richard Joel who is neither a rabbi nor "dr" nor is he a "rosh yeshiva" either, just a "plain" attorney who got the title "CEO" to boot.

      By the way, it was Rabbi Revel who hired Rav Moshe Soloveitchik, sone of the famous Rav Chaim Soloveitchik to be the Rosh Yeshiva of RIETS, the rabbinical school, and after he passed away they chose the famous Rav JB Soloveitchik to fill his place. Is that also some sort of "esoteric knowledge" to you that only "old people" know? Or is something that anyone who has read a few books about would know?

      In any case who hasn't heard of "Mr" Shraga Feivel Mendlowitz of Torah Vo'Daas yeshiva? since you you are such a "litvak" as you claim, it's part of yeshiva velt history, like knowing that Rav Aron Kotler goes with BMG the Lakewood yeshiva and Rav Yoel Teitelabaum was the rebbe who founded Satmar Chasidus and brought it to America.

      Hows about you focus on discussing content and not the identity of posters which is just another sign that you want to distract from what your real goal is here by coming on this blog, to create mischief and spout nonsense and waste everyone's time with your obvious "klotz kashyos"!

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    9. But you claim I am a Satmar Sock puppet?I am not a Litvak or an MO according to you so how would I know about this great man?I did here good thing from everybody about Rav Belkin.The chain of who hires who at YU doesn't really interest me.If you want me off this blog at least have the courtesy of telling me the name of another blog.

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    10. please stop this nonsense - noshie63 you are welcome to continue participating in the discussions

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    11. Why not investigate Rabbis who are members of the RCA who committed adultery and financial crimes . I was told by a past placement director of YU that I could not get a Mechitzah shul after serving in a conservative shul (at YU's behest) and should drive a cab. My wife and I were told by a past president of the RCA that we should "burn in hell" for being in a non Mechitzah shul. In addition the shidduchim of my children would be destroyed. I went public (see YU Commentator articles). Three of my four children are already married and have frum households. _Regarding the current YU situation, face up to it, hire a private investigator and make it public. _Rabbi Dr. Bernhard Rosenberg

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  2. The former students who are now adults deserve credit for speaking out. I taught at Yeshiva College at the same time this occurred and was the go to person for students who had problems. Wish they had known this and come to me. I have shared my experiences with YU and the RCA. I love the school but have had issues with some people. Having raised over 1.5 million for YU in the eighties did not help me from being terminated recently from teacihng Public Speaking despite great reviews; most adjuncts were let go for supposed financial problems. I have served in my current Synagogue for 23 years. The only president who showed me kindness was Dr. Belkin of Blessed Memory I WAS bullied and harrassed by the president of the RCA. in those days. I was denied employment at any Orthodox institution because YU placed me originally in a Conservative Synagogue. It is time for these people to be exposed so it never happens to anyone again, child or adult.
    Rabbi Dr. Bernhard Rosenberg

    Read more: http://forward.com/articles/167588/student-claims-of-abuse-not-reported-by-yeshiva-u/?p=all#ixzz2FEt25812

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  3. Pertinent to several recent posts.

    The view of a (non-anonymous) NY attorney and former NYC prosecutor:

    Excerpt:

    <<

    There is a current faculty member of a local Yeshiva high school who should be in jail. He is not permitted near my children because I know what he has done, and I know what he is capable of. I cannot say, for certain, that he has committed any crime and, therefore, turning him in or outing his misconduct is not viable or appropriate. People with more credibility than me have tried, unsuccessfully, to do something about it. But, I often wonder how similar attitudes have led to graver consequences. And, it raises the following conundrum: By the time we have sufficient evidence to convict, the damage to our children has been done. If we act prematurely, we will face certain censure for slanderous persecution. There needs to be a balance and a process to protect children, detect evil-doers, but respect and defend the rights (and reputation) of the accused, until we are certain of the steadiness of our hands.

    >>

    [At http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ari-weisbrot/sex-lies-and-rabbinical-r_b_2296792.html and also at http://www.huffingtonpost.com/ari-weisbrot/sex-lies-and-rabbinical-r_b_2296792.html]

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    1. Correction: URL http://aweisbrot.wordpress.com/2012/12/13/sex-lies-and-rabbincal-red-tape/

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  4. Just a Civilian:
    The solution is to find the money to have professional people trail the suspect and see what he does. I once saw someone reputed to be evil walking with a group of little children. His face was flaming red. I went over to the children and said, "Stay away from this man, he is crazy." I also told a few people of my suspicions, based on what I heard from reliable people and from my talk with the problem person. The word gets around, but it is not enough.

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    1. why didn't you go to the police or רווחה?

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    2. the Forward is only interested in attacking Orthodox Judaism and using all of you as a ploy. ALL SHOULD STOP COMMENTING AND perhaps this would die out. The students involved are now remembering things that happened in the 60′s and 70′s AND 80′S . D. The bottom line is why didnt the parents go to the police. The excuse that they were afraid the children’s reputations would be destroyed is ludicrous. I would have taken action immediately. DR. LAMM is being used as a fall guy. It would be best if all invilved no longer made comments to the press. Rabbi Dr. Bernhard Rosenberg

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  5. The police can't do anything without someone testifying about a crime. Getting red cheeks is not a crime.

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    1. so why didn't the reliable people go to the police? why was the whole thing handled at the level of spreading rumors?

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  6. Since when do Jewish school administrators need to stop abuse in its tracks and to discipline and expose abusers they know of ONLY if secular law so requires? Administrators have much to do beyond protecting colleagues and complying with non-Jewish civil law. What would a by-the-book administrator do if one colleague abused another as opposed to abusing an innocent child of parents without clout? That would be really thought-provoking, no? In any case, the needed action should be by OUR book, Torah law, that protects the innocent from harm. Was there no Beis Din in YU's orbit back then that could do the proper job?

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    1. Pleads explain what OUR book says about abuse? What did rabbis back then know about abuse? What were the rabbis in those days doing about abuse and abusers?

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    2. Torah law, including the oral and written, deals with all moral problems. This is axiomatic for a Jew. People weren't just invented yesterday. All aspects of human psychology have played out by characters in our tradition. Therefore, the true experts in Torah must have had a handle on this, too. True experts, that is, not just anyone with the right dress code and career path.

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    3. Sorry that answer is not acceptable. I didn't ask for what you believe someone knows but for facts. I have not found any discussion of what we call sexual abuse and the resulting trauma early than the 1800's. I have heard from poskim that they gave little concern for abuse because they were unaware of the psychological damage in abuse cases.

      The current awareness of trauma is recent - basically from the 1970's and came about primarily through the awareness of trauma from the Vietnam war and Women's Liberation movement.

      Itis possible that in earlier generations people abuse didn't cause so much damage and thus it was primarily viewed as a moral issue than pikuach nefesh.

      So instead of wishful thinking - please cite rabbincal sources from the 1970's that said that abusers should be turned over to the police and given therapy and that the victims needed to be given therapy.

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    4. "Therefore, the true experts in Torah must have had a handle on this, too. "

      People have been seeing things fall to the ground since day 1. That doesn't mean that they understand Newtonian Physics.

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  7. DT, please offer some support for your own assertions. I suppose there was no awareness of shellshock, etc., in either World War, by your account. Or trauma to civilian victims during those wars or any previous ones.

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    1. read pages 7-13 in volume I of my Child and Domestic abuse.

      Some examples

      Rabbi David Zweibel executive vice president of Agudath Israel of America The Jewish Daily, October 10, 2008
      “Until not terribly long ago, the issue was very much in the shadows,” said David Zwiebel, director of government affairs and general counsel of Agudath Israel of America. “The fact that there were isolated reports here and there of cases arising in yeshiva settings, it was known, but they were very isolated.”
      “Sometimes they were dealt with correctly and sometimes incorrectly,” Zwiebel added, “but the severity of the problem and the possible magnitude were really things that most people, including myself, just didn’t understand.”
      ====================================
      Encyclopedia Britannica (Child Abuse 2008): Opinions about the scale and nature of child abuse have changed dramatically since the 1960s, and the notion that children are widely subject to abuse and exploitation has become firmly fixed in the public consciousness. Child abuse also has become a major topic of study in academia; themes of incest and abuse are now common in the social and behavioral sciences, as well as in such diverse subjects as literature, social theory, and cultural and women’s studies. The surging interest in child abuse, child protection, and children’s rights was one of the most significant social developments of the late 20th century.

      Dr. Steven Gold (Psychotherapy Winter 1997 34:4 page 365) In a remarkably brief number of years the mental health professions have undergone several dramatic and surprisingly abrupt transformations in their position on childhood sexual abuse (CSA) and its effect on adjustment in adulthood. It is only as recently as the late 1970s and early 1980s that the scope and enduring adverse impact of child abuse came to be widely recognized in the professional and research literature (Browne & Finkelhor, 1986; Courtois, 1988; Meiselman, 1978).

      Dr. Christine A. Courtois & Dr. Steven N. Gold (Psychological Trauma 2009 1:1 page 3). For several decades now, the knowledge base about psychological trauma has been continually expanding in the professional literature (Friedman, Keane, & Resick, 2007). In the earliest days of the practice of psychotherapy in Europe in the late 19th century, trauma was recognized as playing an important role in the genesis and exacerbation of many psychological difficulties; however, for various reasons, appreciation of the relevance of the experience of trauma to many psychological problems waned through much of the 20th century (Friedman, Resick, & Keane, 2007; Herman, 1992b; van der Kolk, 2007; Monson, Friedman, & LaBash, 2007). It was only in the 1970s that the focused attention on psychological trauma resumed. This trend was catalyzed largely by the difficulties exhibited by Vietnam War veterans and emerging awareness, via the feminist movement, of the alarming prevalence of rape, domestic violence, and all forms of childhood abuse.

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  8. Gee, DT, now you are making the same argument as Agudah and Rav Zweibel. You're even quoting Rav Zweibel to support your position that we cannot blame the schools and rabbis from decades past due to their lack of knowledge regarding the damage caused by abuse. Yet not too long ago you, DT, was excoriating Rabbi Zweibel and the Agudah for saying what you are now admitting.

    Welcome to Agudah, DT. Glad you are man enough to admit the errors of your past ways.

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    1. Gee, Philip I am sorry to see you have a major problem in reading comprehension. I just documented that knowledge of the trauma of abuse is relatively recent starting with the 70's and 80's. Somebody at that time my not be aware of the issue. However my criticism of Rabbi Zweibel and the Agudah is for inaction and coverups much more recently when the issue was well known by them.

      Please reread these posts - The point again is that a valid exucse 40 years ago is not necessarily a valid excuse 5 to 10 years ago. Is that too hard to digest?

      http://daattorah.blogspot.co.il/2012/06/saving-kids-lashon-harah-high-price-to.html

      http://daattorah.blogspot.co.il/2012/06/rabbi-zwiebel-aguda-child-abuse.html

      http://daattorah.blogspot.co.il/2012/06/emperor-has-no-clothesrabbinical.html

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    2. So what you are now saying, DT, is simply that you and Rabbi Zweibel of the Agudah simply disagree when to place the timeline for the before and after period as to when it was okay to not understand and do some things to abusers and when people should've already known and done. You place the breaking point in the 80's while Rabbi Zweibel places it a 10 or 15 years later.

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    3. nope! read the posts I cited. In particular note the date here on the Torah u'Mesora letter. Clearly 10 years ago - and surely before they recognized the problem. What did they do about it? When did they publicly acknowledge the problem? Why did Rabbi Zweibel acknowledge the role of the blogs - which is less then 10 years ago - for moving the problem off the back burner? Do you remember when they acknowledged that the police could be called - after consulting a rabbi of course? Was it 10 or 15 years ago? How was the Kolko case at Torah Temima resolved? When did the bombshell of the New York Magazine article come out? When did the Baltimore Declaration against child abuse come out - and then 2 years ago one of the Baltimore rabbis told me that nothing changed from that declaration and the rabbis regreted producing it. etc etc etc. In sum, my criticism is that they clearly did not act responsibly based on knowledge they had that abuse was traumatic and they did not protect the children.

      Torah u’Mesora: Declaration of Rabbinical Board
      Elul 5763
      At recent meetings of the Rabbinical Board of Torah U’Mesorah, attended by Rav Dovid Feinstein, Rav Yitzchok Feigelstock, Rav Aharon Feldman, Rav Shmuel Kamenetsky, Rav Aryeh Malkiel Kotler, Rav Avrohom Chaim Levin, Rav Yaakov Perlow and Rav Aaron Schechter, shlita, the following statement concerning a painful issue was issued:
      We address ourselves to the problem of child molestation in our community. A small number of individuals have caused untold pain to many children, primarily varying in age from three to fourteen. In addition to the sins which they have committed, they have created painful memories in the minds of their victims, memories which can have a devastating lifetime impact.
      It is incumbent upon everyone to use every means to stop these violations of children, including, at times, exposing the identities of the abusers and even their incarceration. At times, our primary intent may not be to punish the perpetrators, but rather to help them. Therefore it is preferable, wherever appropriate, to force them to undergo appropriate professional therapy.
      Torah U’Mesorah is issuing a set of behavioral and reporting standards for principals to implement in their yeshivos and day schools, which, it is hoped, will strengthen the protection of students. It is well documented that molesters are rarely strangers to the child; they are usually relatives or neighbors – and in rare occasions, even teachers. They are able to act because they have the child’s confidence, and then, after the act, they usually threaten him or her with punishment if he or she reveals what has occurred or they shame their victims into keeping a secret.
      It is important that parents advise children in an appropriate manner to beware of potential molesters. Children must be told to advise their parents of any abusive behavior, and assured that they will suffer no consequences if they do so. We encourage rabbanim throughout our communities to address this issue, which, in itself, will serve as a deterrent to potential abusers. Rabbanim must also help and support anyone who has fallen victim to abuse, as well as refer them to seek professional help from frum private practitioners and/or organizations in their

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  9. A point on the historical timeline, pertaining to general public awareness ...

    NY Times, June 20, 1985:
    "SEX CHARGES AGAINST PRIEST EMBROIL LOUISIANA PARENTS"
    URL: http://www.nytimes.com/1985/06/20/us/sex-charges-against-priest-embroil-louisiana-parents.html

    <<

    HENRY, La., June 17— The admission by a Roman Catholic priest that he sexually abused 37 children entrusted to his care has aroused a deep sense of betrayal and shame in this small rural community in southwestern Louisiana.

    ...

    >>


    NY Times, February 8, 1986:
    "AROUND THE NATION: Boy Molested by Priest Given $1 Million by Jury"
    URL: http://www.nytimes.com/1986/02/08/us/around-the-nation-boy-molested-by-priest-given-1-million-by-jury.html

    <<

    ABBEVILLE, La., Feb. 7— A jury awarded $1 million today to an 11-year-old boy who was molested by a priest who is now in prison for sexually abusing three dozen boys.

    ...

    >>

    This was the first of the Catholic cases to receive nationwide press attention. Additional out-of-court settlements were reported at $5.5 million, and the offender was sentenced to 20 years.

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  10. Believe it or not, human decency and indecency preceded the modern era, as did the need to cope with manifestations of the latter. Somehow or other, the world limped along til science enlightened us. Favoring one's in-group over victims of group members has a long, sorry history. This should not happen among Torah-true Jews of any era.

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  11. Finkelstein was my principal and Gordon was my teacher. Both were simply mean, nasty, and malicious. Instead of teaching us the beauty and purpose of Judaism, they turned us off. Many of us left for good, some of us eventually returned. They should be ostracized by the religion they defamed. Anyone who comes in contact with them should turn away. More importantly, Lamm and anyone else that covered up their actions should immediately be held accountable. That means forced to resign and any honors they received over the many years should be withdrawn.

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  12. Why not investigate Rabbis who are members of the RCA who committed adultery and financial crimes . I was told by a past placement director of YU that I could not get a Mechitzah shul after serving in a conservative shul (at YU's behest) and should drive a cab. My wife and I were told by a past president of the RCA that we should "burn in hell" for being in a non Mechitzah shul. In addition the shidduchim of my children would be destroyed. I went public (see YU Commentator articles). Three of my four children are already married and have frum households. _Regarding the current YU situation, face up to it, hire a private investigator and make it public. _Rabbi Dr. Bernhard Rosenberg

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  13. What I do not understand is why parents did not beat up these rabbis if they had the proof and their child suffered. . If it was my child I WOULD HAVE GONE INTO HIS OFFICE AND BEATEN THEM UP. I would go to Israel now and punch them out. RABBI DR. BERNHARD ROSENBERG

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  14. I think that would be the natural response but they waited 35 years and went to the Forward?

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    1. MY SOURCE TELLS ME MR. ANONYMOUS GRADUATED EINSTEIN. MEDICAL SCHOOL OF YESHIVA UNIVERSITY SEEMS LIKE HE OWES Y.U. HIS CAREER. YESHIVA UNIVERSITY is the school where I spent most of of academic life. Do not lecture me on what I owe or do not. For your information, RIETS and .J.S.S. made be who I am. I will fight for the school that produced rabbis that cared for me and nurtured me. It is not my fault that parents who knew of these acts did nothing including showing up in mass to punish the individual who did malice to their child. Do not lecture me on sexual violence. Where were the parents who knew. ? Stop whining and trying to destroy Yeshiva University and have Rabbi Lamm resign. He did what was proper at the time. Prove that Rabbi GORDON molested anyone. The story about the toothbrush is ludicrous. I have had my own issues with the R..C.A. AND Y.U. , but I did not wake up 35 years later to realize I was molested. Go to ISRAEL AND CONFRONT these abusers , they are still alive. I call upon current students and alumni to speak up on behalf of their school. I FOR ONE HAVE HEARD ENOUGH UNPROVEN ALLEGATIONS THAT HAVE RUINED TWO LIVES. DO NOT RESPOND SHAME ON YOU OR I DO NOT UNDERSTAND SEX ABUSE. I understand if this happened to my child and I knew of it I WOULD HAVE CALLED FRIENDS and made sure the culprit never did this to any child again. Rabbi Dr. Bernhard Rosenberg

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  15. the Forward is only interested in attacking Orthodox Judaism and using all of you as a ploy. ALL SHOULD STOP COMMENTING AND perhaps this would die out. The students involved are now remembering things that happened in the 60's and 70's AND 80'S . D. The bottom line is why didnt the parents go to the police. The excuse that they were afraid the children's reputations would be destroyed is ludicrous. I would have taken action immediately. DR. LAMM is being used as a fall guy. It would be best if all invilved no longer made comments to the press. Rabbi Dr. Bernhard Rosenberg

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    1. i think that "it" (the issue of pedophellia) would also die out if "it" were dealt with (apologies for the dangling participle). instead people deal with "it" by blaming the victims, which of course, keeps the issue live and kicking.

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    2. Rabbi: I find your posting offensive. We do not want this to die out. I was a student at YU High School and had Finkelstein and Gordon. And yes,they were Orthodox and were monsters. I have davened in an Orthodox shul my entire life. This is not a conspiracy against the Orthodox or anyone else. The fact of the matter is: liars, cheaters, thieves, wife beaters, killers, and yes child molesters exist in the Orthodox community as well. Being Orthodox unfortunately does not change who some people are. Wake up and stop being paranoid about conspiracies. Lamm should be fired immediately.

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    3. So far there is an anonymous accusation against Rabbi Macy Gordon . The accuser should come forward. Regarding being afraid to tell parents I know that some parents were informed by their children. Instead of remaining silent out of fear for their children's reputation they should have spoken out. I grew up in the Midwest and attended an elementary school where anti Semitism was rampant. There were only two Jewish children in the school; because we were poor we lived in that neighhborhood. Being beaten up because I was Jewish and fighting back was a common occurrence. I knew how to fight back and would have fought against anyone who molested me. Yeshiva students have to be taught to physically protect themselves against abuse.
      Rabbi Dr. Bernhard Rosenberg

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    4. I have to agree.Daas Torah mentions that a person's prospects would or could be damaged by outing one's self.Any person laying a finger on me or my son would be baseball bated!I see no honor in victimhood.The person making the accusations is a very prominent man.There is no

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    5. I have to agree with my esteemed colleague.Any person touching me or my son,Chas VeShalom would get baseball bated!As far as coming forward that would enhance the allegation.The accuser is so prominent that on the merit of his accomplishments and status he would definitely be believed.His father didn't want to hurt his musmachim RIETS relatives but 35 years later he has done just that.Any person with a YU diploma now has to contend with this.I think Rabbi Shmuel Boteach made a very important point."You don't deal with your pain by causing more pain".I can accept every option except going to the Sonei Yisroel press.I would be much tougher on these animals than their victims.There are several options on the table.Daas Torah said that one may go to the press if that was the ONLY option.He can still sue in civil court and he has the resources to do so.There is no glory in being a victim.If he wants revenge it is understandable.If he wants to prevent additional victims he missed the boat by about 35 years or at least his father did.Sorry,I am not into the crybaby stuff.Take some form of action.Put up or shut up.Glad I don't hold a diploma from YU.I don't need the stigma.

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  16. IF YOU CAN PROSECUTE THE ONES WHO HIRT YOUNG KIDS, DO IT. I understand nightmares and terrors, I do not understand why the parents did not beat up the guilty if they violated their children.Sorry to me having respect for a rabbi has nothing to do with his harming my child. I WOULD HAVE BEATEN THE HELL OUT OF HIM.



    THEY COMPLAIN ABOUT WRESTLING and have nightmares. This I UNDERSTAND and have compassion for them. I hate when people judge me for saying the parents should have acted if they knew.





    I was born in a D.P. CAMP and my parents were in AUSCHWITZ AND BUCHENWALD. LOST MOST OF THE FAMILY. these are my nightmares NO ONE SHOULD HAVE TO GO THROUGH LIFE LIKE THIS. , ESPECIALLY YOUNG TEENAGERS. . rabbi dr.

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  17. Submitted by Rolly Sass (not verified) on Sun, 12/30/2012 - 14:13. IN THE JEWISH WEEK


    I am tired of this crybaby stuff.Rabbi DR. BERNHARD Rosenberg is telling a truth people cannot handle.It is one thing to deal with a powerless child.It is another for middle aged men to hide behind a veil of anonymity and cry "victim".There parents were not children.They knew what was going on.How many even pulled their kids out of YU?You mean to tell me that they knew but let their children remain.Gordon and Finklestein should be held responsible.But where were the parents and why didn't they act?

    ReplyDelete
  18. Submitted by Rolly Sass (not verified) on Sun, 12/30/2012 - 14:13. IN THE JEWISH WEEK


    I am tired of this crybaby stuff.Rabbi DR. BERNHARD Rosenberg is telling a truth people cannot handle.It is one thing to deal with a powerless child.It is another for middle aged men to hide behind a veil of anonymity and cry "victim".There parents were not children.They knew what was going on.How many even pulled their kids out of YU?You mean to tell me that they knew but let their children remain.Gordon and Finklestein should be held responsible.But where were the parents and why didn't they act?

    ReplyDelete

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