This is the most astounding statement that this wise, intelligent perceptive person has ever said.
Jewish Media Resources/Jerusalem Post December 24, 2009 Jerusalem Post Comments section
Jewish Media Resources/Jerusalem Post December 24, 2009 Jerusalem Post Comments section
I wish I could say that self-destructive behavior, like that of Tiger Woods, is unknown among Orthodox Jews, or at least among Orthodox rabbis. But I have no particular desire to make a fool of myself.
I am not aware, however, of any figure revered by a large cross-section of Torah Jewry whose private behavior ever stood revealed to be wildly dissonant from his public image. Vast Torah knowledge is usually one aspect of that reverence, but only when it is accompanied by a lifetime of work on self-mastery of one's drives and desires, the subtle as well as the commonplace.
Constant, intense efforts at character development, including knowledge of one's weaknesses and the ability to anticipate the consequences of one's actions, is, at the end of the day, the only protection of against making a terrible botch of our lives.
I guess he has never heard of Jacob Frank, Shabbtai Tzvi, Yosef Delaraina, Kolko, or Leib Tropper.
ReplyDeleteim abit confused by this language, is he saying that there is or there isnt such a thing by the jews?
ReplyDeleteDid Mr. Rosenbloom have to publish this story now?
ReplyDeleteTiger Woods is only accused of womanizing. The issue with Tropper goes way beyond that. Getting his wife in on the act. Pimping through extortion. Multi-million dollar theft. This is only what we know thus far.
Rosenblum writes: "I am not aware, however, of any figure revered by a large cross-section of Torah Jewry whose private behavior ever stood revealed to be wildly dissonant from his public image."
ReplyDeleteThat may be technically true. However, there is certainly a figure honored by a large cross-section of Torah Jewry whose private behavior was revealed to be wildly dissonant from his public image - and who has yet to be publicly condemned for it. In fact, according to current reports, Rav Elya Bet Wachtfogel is arranging a melave malka for Tropper, to give him chizuk.
That may be technically true. However, there is certainly a figure honored by a large cross-section of Torah Jewry whose private behavior was revealed to be wildly dissonant from his public image - and who has yet to be publicly condemned for it.
ReplyDeleteDont forget that the author was/is employed by the EJF see the following link,last name;
ReplyDeletehttp://www.ejfseminars.org/lecturers
"Another Anon said... In fact, according to current reports, Rav Elya Bet Wachtfogel is arranging a melave malka for Tropper, to give him chizuk."
ReplyDeleteHahahaha, it's Tropper's "Last Supper" and his metaphoric "final meal" before sentence is executed and he's stripped of ALL positions and influence and thrown entirely to the gutter where he belongs, with his wife to keep him company!
Won't be long now. Tropper was already FORCED to quit as head of EJF.
R EB Wachtfogel was FORCED to quit as his successor.
R Reuven Feinstein is being FORCED to give an accounting.
R Nochum Eisenstein is being FORCED to shut up.
Tropper's rabbinic friends are being FORCED to eat humble pie and admit that Rav Shternbuch was 100% correct.
And that's just after a week of this!
Not only is Rosenbloom one of Tropper's lackeys but he has written falsehoods before in his role as a writer for the Agudas Yisroel of America.
ReplyDeleteHe wrote two pieces covering up child abuse that were shockingly dishonest and he would not back down in the face of fierce criticism. Rosenbloom also committed character assassination on the child victim advocates.
Ohel's CEO David Mandel did the same thing writing in the Jewish Observer.
These characters know that if they write the truth they are finished.
Mandel will be out of his job which according to IRS documents pays 330k per annum and Rosenbloom will no longer get plum writing assignments from 42 Broadway.
So which shita of Nittel Nacht are they using to convene the fressing? Tonight or January 6th?
ReplyDeleteAlso bear in mind the onesh that reserved for Yoshke vos shteit in Chazal.
http://curiousjew.blogspot.com/2009/12/rabbi-leib-tropper.html
ReplyDeleteWhat amazes me is that he can rationalize twisting Torah to support what he desires. I can understand the desire; I can't understand speaking of davening to God regarding an extramarital affair. How can you daven to God to support a sin? Perhaps you can pray to Him out of pain, to say that you know this is wrong but you hope He will forgive you but how can you pray to him to support you in your sin? I don't understand.
The entire affair just makes me want to cry.
http://honestlyfrum.blogspot.com/2009/12/another-word-on-tropper.html
ReplyDeleteHis statement appears on VIN and here it is:
"Rabbi Leib Tropper’s response to recent allegations has been delayed until now in deference to his legal counsel.
Events of recent weeks have caused Rabbi Tropper great anguish ..."
This piece of trash wants us to feel sorry for him because this episode has caused him "anguish"? What about the anguish that this vile person caused all the geirim
http://religion.lohudblogs.com/2009/12/22/influential-ultra-orthodox-rabbi-from-monsey-caught-in-sex-scandal/
ReplyDeleteTropper makes it into the Rockland Journal so now all his goyishe neighbors know about the chilul Hashem too.
How about Rubashkin and their sweatshop, where your chance of getting injured was a mere 16 times Iowa average, you didn't always get your overtime pay, and you didn't complain because your (Hispanic) foreman is in league with the extortionists who smuggled you into the US?
ReplyDeleteWhen I hear a frum Jew complain about how meat prices went up since Agri's closure, and I am wondering how people could look back nostalgically once they knew who was paying what kind of price in order to make that possible.
The Spinka Rebbe (although I am impressed with how he is doing teshuvah for it). Then the wider scandal across Williamsburg, Deal and the NJ political spectrum, as one informant turned in dozens.
Rather than seeing us as a community that demonstrates the effects of character development, I see a community that shows what happens when you "water your weeds", rather than weed one's middos before pouring the water of Torah on them. (To use the Gra's metaphor from Even Sheleimah.)
-micha
Micha, dont be a fool. Agriprocessors is completely and entirely different than the Tropper scandal. The latter is what it is. Agriprocessors was the result of a corporate campaign by another greedy union. The heads of the UFCW were looking for a fe hundred more dues money to come in a month to support their leaders gargantuan salaries. As usual, when it comes to unions, its the employees who got screwed.
ReplyDeleteYonason Rosenblum just published this piece on cross-currents with added commentary to clarify his intentions - http://www.cross-currents.com/archives/2009/12/28/tiger-and-us/
ReplyDeleteThere are a number of problems with Rosenblum's article. He limits his claim to those who are greatly respected by a broad spectrum of people. How many Gedolim are included in that? Rav Metzger? Rav Wachtfogel?
ReplyDeleteFurthermore, Gedolim are usually only crowned as such when they reach their seventies. Anyone engaging in indiscretions will have done so long before that - and will then not be crowned as a Gadol.
Finally, according to Abarbanel, even greats such as David HaMelech were not immune from having "feet of clay."
Rubashkin is not that different than Tropper. DOn't believe the Agudah-Chabad propaganda that it was all a union plot.
ReplyDeleteThe employees were taken advantage of and abused and the women were victims of terrible crimes with knowledge of management.
Otherwise the kashrus stank which is why KAJ finally bailed out. This was the a consumer fraud of the highest order considering all the kashrus & health problems with the meat.
It is interesting - I usually atatck Rosenblum fromt he left/MO point of view. But this guy is totally delusional. He is not even giving a Haredi or Daas Torah point of view. He is giving a Manchurian candidate brainwash version of reality. It is not even worth responding on his website - the guy is nuts.
ReplyDeleteANd since when does somebody use a goyisher sports personality as a role model to compare to rabbis? A sportsman is simply very good at the physical. Did anyone expect him to be faithful?
Where are the real Talmidei Hachamim of today? They are not the ones who write these ridiculous articles on Jpost or Yated.
Why are people not talking of Ramban and rambam, and instead are using all this freshman kiruv nonsense, which noone believes in anyway.
Even Chabad have more sechel than these slick used car salesmen!!!!
Where is the lomdus gone?
Sadly, as anybody who's bothered reading his professional 'fluff jobs' over the years is aware, Jonathan Rosenblum tends to see things very selectively. As a paid writer for a group with a very narrow view of Torah and Yiddishkeit, Rosenblum liberally laces his articles/boks with exaggerations, while blindly defending anybody tied to his 'camp'. This would, tragically, include abusers, frauds, and any other creators of massive chillul-hashem, as long as they seem to conform with his distorted idea of 'daas torah'.
ReplyDeleteIt is almost impossible to explain truth to a man whose livelihood depends on his not understanding it...
> I am not aware, however, of any figure revered by a large cross-section of Torah Jewry whose private behavior ever stood revealed to be wildly dissonant from his public image
ReplyDeleteHa! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! etc.