The recent events with the Weberman case in Brooklyn and apparently a similar situation in London, calls for a serious discussion of the integration of secular psychology with Judaism. The problems for treatment of the opposite gender, conflict in values and goals. And what happens when the therapist takes on the role of the rabbis in teaching values and roles in marriage versus the rabbi taking on the role of therapist. Tomorrow I will be posting an important article sent to me by Dr. Klafter on this topic. Today I want to pose a question which someone asked me that clearly indicates the problems.
There is an organization which provides therapy to frum clients using trained psychologists and social workers. The organization has a posek who has answered their questions for years. Recently a question arose dealing with a wife who was severely abused in all possible ways. She has been destroyed psychologically without any self-esteem or ability to function as an independent entity. Therapy and the law requires that she be treated as a separate entity and be given the skills and confidence to decide whether she wants to get divorced. The Rav insists that the Torah requires that the husband be involved in her therapy and especially the issues of divorce.
What would you advise?
First update - the other side of the story.
After some investigation, I found out the rav's point of view. He had been informed by a number of people who had worked with the couple previously for shalom bayis that the woman's account of abuse are questionable and might possibly indicate delusions and psychosis. The rav said that the reality of the woman's story needs to be verified with others before giving her treatment as an abused person who probably should get divorced. The wife refuses for the therapist to speak to her husband and the therapist believes she is telling the truth. Legally and ethically a therapist can not go behind a clients back to solicit information when the client objects. Thus the rav is not asserting that the husband has to be involved because he is a husband but because of the need to clarify the truth of her claims. Thus there is a clear conflict between the values of secular therapy and secular law and the Torah position
Second update: Thursday Nov 29
Another case. A troubled marriage of a couple who are at the highest levels of Torah society. If they get divorced it will destroy their children's chance of happiness in shidduchim. Therapist insists that the marriage is unhealthy and supports wife call for a divorce. Their rebbe tells the therapist to provide wife with sedatives so she can survive the marriage until the kids are married off. This is a question of values - not reality or professional judgment. Does the therapist have to listen to the rav or does his Ph.D. exempt him from Torah obligations as seen by the rav
Third update - another case
I remember, as a bachor in yeshiva, speaking to the psychologist of one of my fellow students who became psychotic. The therapist told me, "the basic problem is you people don't touch girls until you are married. My client would be way better off psychologically if he got a girl friend." When I objected that this was against our religious laws, he snickered and said, "It is my professional view that this is necessary for my client's well being." Would you require that a prostitute be hired until he got a girl friend because a licensed expert in the field of pscyhology said it was necessary?
Fourth update - December 1 2012 What does it mean when a rav issues a psak in medical issues -
See Rav Sternbuch paskens that alternative medicine can't be used instead of conventional medicine in pikuach nefesh cases
First update - the other side of the story.
After some investigation, I found out the rav's point of view. He had been informed by a number of people who had worked with the couple previously for shalom bayis that the woman's account of abuse are questionable and might possibly indicate delusions and psychosis. The rav said that the reality of the woman's story needs to be verified with others before giving her treatment as an abused person who probably should get divorced. The wife refuses for the therapist to speak to her husband and the therapist believes she is telling the truth. Legally and ethically a therapist can not go behind a clients back to solicit information when the client objects. Thus the rav is not asserting that the husband has to be involved because he is a husband but because of the need to clarify the truth of her claims. Thus there is a clear conflict between the values of secular therapy and secular law and the Torah position
Second update: Thursday Nov 29
Another case. A troubled marriage of a couple who are at the highest levels of Torah society. If they get divorced it will destroy their children's chance of happiness in shidduchim. Therapist insists that the marriage is unhealthy and supports wife call for a divorce. Their rebbe tells the therapist to provide wife with sedatives so she can survive the marriage until the kids are married off. This is a question of values - not reality or professional judgment. Does the therapist have to listen to the rav or does his Ph.D. exempt him from Torah obligations as seen by the rav
Third update - another case
I remember, as a bachor in yeshiva, speaking to the psychologist of one of my fellow students who became psychotic. The therapist told me, "the basic problem is you people don't touch girls until you are married. My client would be way better off psychologically if he got a girl friend." When I objected that this was against our religious laws, he snickered and said, "It is my professional view that this is necessary for my client's well being." Would you require that a prostitute be hired until he got a girl friend because a licensed expert in the field of pscyhology said it was necessary?
Fourth update - December 1 2012 What does it mean when a rav issues a psak in medical issues -
See Rav Sternbuch paskens that alternative medicine can't be used instead of conventional medicine in pikuach nefesh cases




