Aseh L'cha Rav - The importances of establishing a Rav for yourself

Aseh L'cha Rav.

I have, and have had, many great Rabbonim as teachers.

My Rabbi growing up was Rabbi Arthur Bogner, z"l a Man of Truth. His sons-in-law had a Yeshiva Ohr Torah D'Brisk where Rabbi Dovid Eidensohn learned as a young man. Rabbi Herzel Kranz Shlita of the Silver Spring  welcomed Aharon Friedman to our Minyan. Only because certain members of the community rioted and seemed poised to close down the Shul is it that Aharon does not Daven here where I am now composing this post.

Many of my Rabbis had opponents and challengers. Rabbi Bogner, at a time when I believe he was the senior Rav on the local Vaad, left the Vaad over a matter of principle. Some local Rabbis opposed Rabbi Kranz building the SSJC.

My advice to young people: research and explore and examine the corrupt Rabbis, and discover the Men of Truth on the opposing side. And then sit in the dust at their feet and hold on with all your heart, soul, and might.

Under the guidance of Rabbi Dovid Eidensohn I am building a Yeshiva here that teaches the Old Fashioned Torah. Young Men and Women, you are invited to join our community and to live a life of complete Torah and Mitzvos.

Joe Orlow
(301) 812-4050
market@softwine.press

Tamar Epstein Heter: The damage being done to yeshiva and seminary students?

I was recently informed that this topic is of particularly great concern to the young people in the yeshivos and seminaries. Much of what is happening goes against what they have taught about gedolim and Daas Torah. Many of them understandably express shock and simply can't digest it.

I think it would be helpful if some of the new generation wrote guest posts that I could post here. It is important that our leaders realize fully the destruction that has been caused by this corruption of the halacha process and the apparent lack of leadership in resolving it. Please do not include indentifying information. However do include how this crisis has impacted you personally.

Tamar Epstein's Heter: Money can metaher [purify] a mamzer

One of the puzzling questions in the present scandal is why this mess has not been resolved either by 1) simply presenting the obvious facts that the "heter" is based on lies and is a corruption of halacha and is causing adultery and mamzerim or 2) the fact that a wide range of important rabbis have denounced the heter.

This question can be answered with another question - why have so many rabbis remained silent in the face of the clear violation of one of the most severe sins. Of course some of this silence is the results from the hesitancy to publicly criticize some extremely important rabbis and the resulting chilul haShem. But the real answer lies elsewhere  - it is the issue of conflict of interest where rabbis don't want to offend those who provide significant support to their institutions and followers. 

This is not a case of explicit blackmail - but simply an awareness of these leaders that there might be dire consequences for taking a public stand. Thus they leave it to others who are less vulnerable to protest. I have heard of no case where a gvir has stated that he will punish anyone who denounces the "heter". But the fear that it might happen has had a very chilling effect.

A possible example of this influence is the well known benefactor of many Torah causes - Shimmy Glick. He is very close with Rav Steinman and Rav Dovid Cohen - and many others. What is the impact of his son being married to Tamar Epstein's sister? I don't know and I have not heard any claim criticizing him in any way. But I have heard from a number of rabbis that many people - especially in Bnei Brak - have not responded because they are afraid that there might be consequences to the benefits they receive from him. 

I myself attended a meeting with the son of a very important rabbi - who listened to all the charges and read all the letters and concluded that this was truly a terrible matter. But then said there was nothing that could be done and his father would not get involved - end of discussion. I was told by knowledgeable insiders that his father receives significant support from American's who are close with Rav Shmuel Kaminetsky - and therefore the father would not get involved.

In sum, we see this scandal of the  "heter" as not only a chilul haShem but one that has exposed the vulnerability of our leaders to virtual blackmail. It has shown the ability of a small number of very wealthy people to make the rabbis dance to their tune - or at least to ignore clear Torah obligations. As Rav Sternbuch told me - "Money can metaher [purify]a mamzer." [see Kiddushin (71a) and Rashi's comment].

Nechemya Weberman appeal of sentence for sexual abuse - rejected

 

Tamar Epstein's Heter: This issue will only be resolved if Aharon Friedman files a massive lawsuit against those who have tried to destroy him

It has been convincingly argued that the only way to resolve this crisis is through a lawsuit. In this post I will present the need  for a multimillion dollar suit for defamation against Rav Shmuel Kaminetsky and his son Shalom , Rav Nota Greeenblatt, Tamar and her family, ORA and their halachic advisor Rav Schachter, the Goldfein's, the beis din that issued a phony seruv against Aharon, the Silver Spring community, the anonymous therapist who wrote the report against Aharon and a number of other individuals. There are no lack of lawyers who would like the job and would take it on a contingency basis and who feel that it won't be difficult to win. It is not a problem finding a beis din that will permit the lawsuit.

Probably the only reason that it hasn't happened so far is Aharon Friedman's lack of vindictiveness and  optimism that people will finally understand the injustice that has been done to him. He hopes that he will soon get back his reputation and the greater access to his daughter that he has requested and he will reciprocate by giving Tamar a Get. In short he is a mensch and has no desire for revenge. He also still hasn't lost his faith in the case being resolved in Beis Din. 

However unless the entire Agudah gets involved - it is not going to happen.  I will argue that he will not get his repuation back without a lawsuit to motivate people to change. This post also serves as a wakeup call to those who feel if they stonewall - that the storm will pass eventually. Simply put - time is running out for an alternative solution.

 [to be continued]

Tamar Epstein's Heter: Many rabbis around the world join Rav Moshe Sternbuch's protest

מכון טעם ודעת

רבנים מכל העדות והחוגים בארץ ובארה"ב מצטרפים למחאתו של מרן פוסק הדור

הגר"מ שטרנבוך שליט"א נגד ההיתר שניתן בארה"ב לאשת איש להינשא ללא גט מבעלה  (מצורף מסמכים)

במקביל, בארה"ב הרוחות סוערות, הרב שסידר את הקידושין פרסם מכתב הכחשה על הפרסומים שהוא התיר את הדבר, ויחד עם זאת, רבני התאחדות הרבנים בארה"ב החרימו את הוראותיו והודיעו שאין לסמוך עליו יותר

כזכור, לפני כחודש פורסם דבר ה'היתר' המחודש שניתן לאשה בשם תמר עפשטיין להינשא לשוק בלא גט פיטורין כדין תורה מבעלה הראשון, בטענה חריגה שהקידושין הראשונים התבטלו מדין 'מקח טעות'.

תקופה קצרה לאחר נתינת ההיתר, סידרו לה קידושין בארה"ב עם יהודי בשם 'אדם פליישר', צעד שעורר מיד סערה רבתי בארה"ב.

יצוין כי בתקשורת החילונית מיהרו לקפוץ על ההזדמנות, ובעקבות ההיתר המפוקפק פורסם בסוף השבוע האחרון מאמר שטנה מלא רעל וארס בעיתון מעריב' תחת הכותרת 'אפשר להירגע, הרבנות והרבנים נחלשים'.

כותב המאמר בעיתון 'מעריב' מגיע למסקנה עגומה בעקבות ההיתר שניתן לאשה תמר עפשטיין: "יש כאן חדשות טובות, כל מי שעסוק בבהלה מיותרת מפני הרבנים והרבנות והמי יודע מה שהם יעשו בפעם הבאה, יכול להירגע. הרבנות והרבנים נחלשים. לא מתחזקים", עפ"ל. (מצורף מסמך).

רבנים וגדולי תורה שפרטי המעשה הגיעו לאוזניהם, מיהרו לפרסם קול מחאה והביעו דעתם שלא ישתקו לנוכח נבלה כזאת שנעשתה בישראל בפרהסיה ועלולה להוות מכשול ותקלה חמורה בקדושת ישראל.

בראש החזית במערכה לשמירת גדרי ההלכה, נעמדו בפרץ מרן פוסק הדור הגר"מ שטרנבוך שליט"א, ואתו עמו הגאון הגדול רבי אהרן פלדמן שליט"א חבר מועצת גדולי התורה בארה"ב וראש ישיבת נר ישראל בבולטימור, אשר עושים ומעשים יומם ולילה כדי לבלום את הפרצה הנוראה.

מרן פוסק הדור הגר"מ שטרנבוך שליט"א פרסם מכתב מחאה חריף כנגד ההיתר שניתן בארה"ב, כאשר בתוך דבריו החריפים כתב "אין לי מנוחה שאין שומעים קול מחאה על כבוד ה' ותורתו", ובסיומו הביע דעת תורה ופסק הלכה נחרץ שהאשה תמר עפשטיין היא אשת איש לכל דבר, ובניה מאדם פליישר הם ממזרים לכל דבר, ואסורים לבוא בקהל. (המכתב מצורף).

הגאון הגדול רבי אהרן פלדמן שליט"א מגדולי התורה ומקברניטי היהדות החרדית בארה"ב, מיהר מיד לזעוק ולהתריע כנגד ההיתר, ובמכתב חריף הממוען 'לגדולי התורה וההוראה די בכל אתר ואתר', ביאר הרב פלדמן את פרטי המקרה, וביקש מרבני ישראל לזעוק ולהתריע כנגד ההיתר והפרצה העצומה המהווה תקלה עצומה ביסודות קדושת הדת. (המכתב המלא מצורף).

המכתבים הנחרצים עוררו סערה רבתי בארץ ובעולם, וגררו בעקבותיהם מכתבי מחאה רבנים מרבנים נוספים בארץ ובעולם שהתריעו כנגד ה'היתר' המסוכן.

הגאון הגדול רבי שריאל רוזנברג שליט"א אב"ד בי"ד בני ברק שבראשות מרן הגאב"ד הגר"נ קרליץ שליט"א הצטרף גם הוא לקול המחאה, וכתב "רעדה אחזתני לשמוע כי יש הרוצים להתיר אשת איש לעלמא...דבר זה הוא הריסת הדת ופרצת כל חומות הקדושה והטהרה בכרם בית ישראל". (המכתב מצורף).

גם גדולי הרבנים בארה"ב וקנדה הגאון הגדול רבי שלמה מילר שליט"א ראש הכולל בטורונטו, הגאון הגדול רבי אלי' דב וואכטפוגל שליט"א ראש ישיבת זכרון מנחם סאוט פאלסבורג, והגאון הישיש משה גרין שליט"א ראש ישיבה דמאנסי, חתמו על מכתב חריף כנגד ההיתר "כהיום נתרבו קלי דעת הרוצים להתיר כל העגונות בטענת מזויפות של מקח טעות, והתורה ח"ו נשארה עגונה, ואין מבקש באמת מהו ההלכה עפ"י האמת, ומספיק שיש להם שום רב שהתיר להם ולא איכפת להם אם אמר כהלכה אם לא". (המכתב מצורף)

כמו כן הרבנים הגאונים חברי בד"ץ התאחדות הרבנים דארצות הברית וקנדה יצאו בקול קורא תחת הכותרת "הכזונה יעשה את אחותינו", כאשר את דבריהם הם חותמים בפסק הלכה נחרץ - "אנו מכריזים בכח תורתינו הקדושה, שהאשה תמר אסתר למשפחת עפשטיין אסורה לבעלה ולבועל, ובניה מהבועל יהיו ממזרים, ועל הרבנים שידם במעל מוטל לעשות כל מה שבאפשרותם להפריש האשה מהבועל, ולפרסם ברבים שמכשול נורא יצא מאתם". (המכתב מצורף).

כמו כן גם הרבנים הגאונים חברי בד"ץ "שערי משפט" בירושלים העומדים בפרץ בעניינים אלו, כתבו מכתב חריף בעניין - "כיהודה ועוד לקרא הננו מצטרפים לפסק דינו של מרן הגר"מ שטרנבוך שליט"א, ועמו כל גדולי אמריקה אשר ביררו את הפרטים היטב, שהאשה הזו הינה בחזקת אשת איש ומוכרחת לקבל גט מבעלה הראשון". (המכתב מצורף).

לאחר מספר שבועות, לאחר שבד"ץ העדה החרדית סיימו להתעסק בכל מה שטרד את סדר יומם, התפנו גם הם לעסוק בפרצה זו הנוגעת ליסוד קדושת עם ישראל ופוגעת בעיקרי הדת והאמונה, והצטרפו לקול מחאתו של מרן פוסק הדור הגר"מ שטרנבוך שליט"א, ובמכתב חריף תחת הכותרת "נבלה נעשתה בישראל", כתבו הרבנים הגאונים חברי בד"ץ העדה החרדית "אנו מוחים נמרצות כנגד זה, ומודיעים שאין ההיתר היתר בשום פנים ואופן, אוי לאוזנים שכך שומעות, ואוי לו לדור שכך עלתה בימיו". (קובץ מצורף).

גם הגאון רבי שמואל יהודה ליב לאנדעסמאן שליט"א אב"ד בעיר מאנסי, כתב מכתב ארוך המתפרס ע"פ כעשרה עמודים, והביע חוות דעתו שאין שום יסוד להיתר שניתן בהכרח רק מחמת חסרון ידיעת פרטי המציאות.  

לאור המחאות החריפות בארץ ובעולם, פרסם הרב שסידר חופה וקידושין לאשה תמר עפשטיין בלא גט מבעלה, מכתב התנצלות מסויגת, והכחשה על השמועות לפיהם הוא הרב שנטל על שכמו את ההכרעה בסוגיא זו. "אאשר פה בכתב מה שאמרתי לכמה ת"ח ששאלו, והוא, שאיני מכיר את מר אהרן פרידמן שיחי', או את מרת תמר עפשטיין שתחי', ובוודאי שלא שייך שאדע דבר על נישואיהם, ולא על שום פרט שביניהם אלא שהגאון ר' שלום קמינצקי שליט"א שאל לי כשיש עדות של רופאים מומחים על אחד שהוא חולה רוח שמפריע לנישואים אם שייך לבטל קידושין משום זה, ואמרתי שאם הדבר ברור ובדומה למעשה שבתשובה שבאגר"מ, שייך בתנאים מסוימים". (קובץ מצורף).

במקביל, בית הדין שע"י התאחדות הרבנים השיבו אש במכתב חריף וחריג במיוחד, בו הם כותבים כי היות שהרב שסידר את הקידושין לא הסכים לנקוט בשום פעולה מעשית להפריש את האשה תמר עפשטיין מיד הבועל אדם פליישר, לכן אין לסמוך יותר על הוראותיו בדיני התורה.

"על כן דעתינו דעת תורה שמהיום אין לרנ"ג הנ"ל שום סמכות לדון ולהורות בדיני התורה, וכן לסדר קידושין וגיטין, ואנו פונים לבתי הדין ומסדרי הקידושין, שלא לקבל ולא לסמוך על גיטין שיסודרו על ידו, ועד שלא תיקן את הדבר הרי הוא בכלל חוטא ומחטיא את הרבים, ואם יוולד בנים להזוג, אמרו חז"ל בכגון דא שהוא מעוות לא יוכל לתקון". (קובץ מצורף)

החידוש המעניין שבמכתב, הוא העובדא שהגאון המפורסם רבי יחזקאל רוטה אבד"ק קארלסבורג שליט"א צירף גם הוא את חתימתו למכתב החריף והנדיר, ואף יצא מגדרו והוסיף על המכתב כמה שורות במילים חריפות במיוחד.

בימים אלו עדיין פועלים גדולי התורה בארה"ב בפעילות קדחתנית לגדור את הפרצה הנוראה שנפרצה בארה"ב, וכפי המסתמן, גדולי תורה נוספים בארץ ובארה"ב, יצטרפו ויחתמו אף הם לקול המחאה שאמור לזעזע את אמות הסיפים בארץ ובארה"ב. 

Some Thoughts About Chanuka 5776 by RaP

Guest post by RaP

 

Meeting a few Jews today and talking about the current situation in Israel, America, terrorism, Jihadis, Donald Trump and reactions to him, a few things came to my mind that are worth sharing.

 

You know, I looked at the young men who were having the discussion that I was part of, I said the problem is the Jews, that Jews do not know how to be real Jews. We are very far away from knowing who we are and what we are supposed to be. They looked at me in surprise. So I continued.

Look at the Israelis, they are confused. Especially the secular Israelis, why are they so soft in confronting threats when their grandparents knew how to protect themselves? When the Arabs attacked Israel in 1947, the Jews fought back and won. When the Arabs blocked off the Suez Canal in 1956 the Israelis fought back and won. When the Arabs massed their armies to destroy Israel and the Jews in 1967, Israel won in six days! When the Arabs attacked in 1973 on Yom Kippur, the Israelis fought back and won. And many other examples like this. So why can't the Israelis win today?

 

And I said, because the previous generations, even if they were secular and not religious they knew about the Pogroms and the Holocaust. While today's generation is dreaming of "peace" and not just peace but they are dreaming of dancing with the Arabs not just that they are dreaming of going to have a good time in New York, Paris, and have a good time in the discothèques. They are not thinking of fighting and winning, they are thinking about how they can be with the world and dance at their parties.

 

I said, what if someone breaks into your house and starts stabbing everyone and you sit around and basically don't do much to protect yourself. Who is at fault? Of course it is you because you are expected to defend yourself and defeat the attacker otherwise you are a fool!

So my listeners said to me, what will the world say? There is nothing we can do!

I said really? And asked them, do you happen to know what holiday we are celebrating right now? And they looked at me, still not getting it. People think that Chanuka is about "lights" and "parties" and fun! I said that in the times of the ancient Greeks, they occupied Eretz Yisrael, and the Jews started to assimilate and join them, to become Misyavnim - Hellenists. And just like today it did not end with just copying the Greeks and wanting to be like them, but with that came intermarriage and Shmad, apostasy as Jews started to convert to the Avoda Zara of the Greeks, just like today secular Jews are assimilated, marrying Christian and Muslim gentiles and being lost to Yiddishkeit.

 

So what happened, at a certain point there was a man by the name of Matisyahu (no, not the singer I told them) but he was Matisyahu the Kohen Gadol, the High Priest, and one day he had enough and fought back. He picked up a sword and killed a Greek official and an apostate Jew who was going to serve an idol and guess what happened next? The Jews won, they defeated the Greeks, regained their own land and re-dedicated the Bais HaMikdash, and that is what Chanuka means, the "re-dedication" not just of the Bais HaMikdash but of the triumph of Torah over the secular world, of light over darkness, the few defeated the many and they survived.

That is the moral of Chanuka because after 2000 years of wandering around in the Golus and having to pay our dues we had to bow our heads, but now that so many Jews are back in Eretz Yisrael, they are back home and at home you have the responsibility to protect yourself or else you are a fool.

 

A day in the life of a Jew on Chanuka 5776.

Tamar Epstein's heter: It is no longer what Rav Greenblatt and Rav Kaminetsky did but their stature as gedolim that is being criticized

 I received this email this morning and thought it important to post along with my respoonse

 Rabbi Eidensohn,

I believe that the spurious Hetter granted to Tamar E. upsets and distresses me no less than it does for you and all other Shloimei Yisroel, but I have to protest most strongly the direction I am hearing your blog has been going recently.....as long as you are attacking the Hetter itself (as vehemently as necessary) you are on safe ground, but recently you have been attacking people and attaching their pictures, which is far more questionable...

Reb Nota, and more so Reb Shmuel K., are very respected Zkanim. Besides the dubious gain (their admirers now consider them "Nirdofim" and more simplistic Yidden are completely confused as to how to view respected Rabbonim and Roshei-Yeshivos), this is a huge Halbonas Ponnim Berabbim, which - even when allowed - has to be completely LeShem-Shomayim (see Igros-Moshe about "Kano'im Pogim), and who can be secure in that....that the likes of Yuddel Shain have joined this campaign only detracts from the way it's perceived!!

Get back on track,

Kol Tuv

======================

I understand very well your point. But I also understand that by their continued refusal in the face of world wide condemnation by rabbonim from all circles - the situation is changing.

It is no longer that two widely revered and liked gedolim inadvertently made mistakes of a serious nature - which does indeed require a focus on the deeds and not the person. It is now their refusal to acknowledge and retract an error - which is obvious to most people - that is  destroying emunas chachomim and creating a huge chilul haShem that is the problem. It is no longer about what they did - but who they are.

When rabbonim call for the rejection of Rav Greenblatt's gittin - it is rejection of Rav Greenblatt as a gadol b'Torah. When Rav Kaminetsky is pointedly uninvited by senior rabbis in England from a conference - it is rejecting Rav Kaminetsky as a gadol b'Torah. It is not my blog which has shifted the focus to their stature as gedolim - but rabbonim around the world. My blog is merely reflecting this change - which everyone knew would eventually happen.

The longer they refuse to acknowledge their direct role in causing an adulterous relationship through a corruption of the halachic process - with the consequences of producing mamzerim - the greater is the damage to Klall Yisroel and the greater is the need to use stronger measures.

The fact that they are - or perhaps were - highly respected men who have devoted their long lives to successfully developing Yiddishkeit and helping others - makes the damage they are causing that much greater. They are running out of time to save their well deserved reputations and stem the serious damage they are causing to all that they hold dear.

I don't think either of them would allow one of their devoted followers to persist in stonewalling against such an obvious error - why do you think they should not be held to the same standard. Why do you think that they should not be held personally accountable for this travesty? 

It is their continued refusal to acknowledge they were wrong that is now the problem. It is no longer so much about Tamar's heter - but it is about gedolim who can not say they were wrong and do teshuva.

Tamar Epstein's Heter: A Day at Heter Inc.

Guest post by Joe Orlow


Can you explain what you do at Heter Inc.?

Well, the word "Heter" is "permission" in English. If I may make a play on words, we are on a "pure mission" to give permission to women. The operative principle here is that "Whatever Lola wants, Lola gets!"

But why is it only "permission to women"?

Nonsense and stuff! Men benefit also. Let me give an example. A young man was offered a prestigious teaching position in a school. There was one condition. He had to marry first. The mother of the young man complained to us. We asked the mother a few questions. It turns out the boy was a slob! He used to be negligent in separating his dark and white laundry!!

Can you believe such insanity?! We contacted a psychological expert (actually the building superintendent here who has a Phd in counseling from an online certificate mill) and he diagnosed the young man as "BI" (Bleach Insensitive). No woman would ever put up with that! The man was unmarriageable. Without our Heter the man would have been out on the street. No tickee, no shirtee!

I notice you have you have a lot of people working here. How do you raise
money?

The money comes from purely voluntary donations that we insist get paid upfront. We need a large staff. You think contacting experts all over the world to sign on to our Heters is easy? Sometimes we have to make upwards of a thousand calls before we find someone without Fear of Heaven.

What do you find the most challenging part of your job?

Dealing with our competitor "Open Door Orthodoxy". When they need a Heter they sometimes uproot the tradition. Can you believe that? Heterics [sic]! We may contort, twist, and mangle, but we are proud of our strict adherence to the ways of our holy ancestors.

Have you ever been forced to retract a Heter?

Never! Our Heters come with a lifetime warranty. If someone finds a hole in one, we simply deny, deny, deny.

What about the Daas Torah blog? How do you answer up commenters like Kishkeyum and Ehud?

Listen, Mister! We don't use language like that around here. Truth, wit, and logic have no place in formulating a Heter Inc. Heter. Watch your tongue!

One last question. What advice do you have for a budding Heter Macher?

Leave aside the books and Shimush of True Wise Ones. Bench warming, obsequiousness, and unquestioning obedience is your shot at a spot on the dais at the Convention. And once you are at the top, you too will be able to do whatever you want without regard to anyone.

Tamar Epstein's Heter: Baltimore Beis Din and major Israeli rabbis reject heter

Rav Chaim Kanievsky 

Rav Sariel Rosenberg    Rav Yehuda Silman    Rav Nissim Karelitz 

Rav Chaim Wosner    Rav Shmuel Eliezer Stern    Rav Yitzchok Zilberstein

Rav Sternbuch's radio interview - RaP's observations

update with link to program and postscript

Listen to Episode #39


Gut Voch Rabbi Eidensohn:

I heard Rav Shternbuch on the radio tonight (Motzei Shabbos at 11 PM in NYC, and he will be on again) it was advertised in full page glossy ads in both the latest English Mishpacha and Modia magazines and they spoke about the Tamar case mentioning her by name as well as other parts of the case. It was interesting and a privilege to hear Rav Shternbuch speak, it was by phone and sounded like it was pre-recorded. The interviewer Dovid Lichtenstein seems to know some Halacha and tried to lead Rav Shternbuch along, but Rav Shternbuch was the consummate Halachist, very cautious, only responding to hard questions and Shaylos and not responding to speculations or theoretics that the interviewer threw in. Rav Shternbuch made the same points that you have conveyed on your blog and I have to tell you that I think you have done a much better job of conveying Rav Shternbuch's views because Rav Shternbuch speaks with that heavy English accent like an old English gentleman so the words are not always clear especially for an American audience not used to such an accent, so therefore as I say your Blog presents the case and Rav Shternbuch's point of view with greater clarity and with less distractions.

But as I say it was worthwhile listening and even my wife paid attention and listened to the entire interview with me. One needs great familiarity with sources because Rav Shternbuch is not talking as if to babies, it is after all the Rosh Bais Din of the BADATZ so he is brief, concise and to the point, very judicial which I am sure the average layperson is not familiar with. But for me it was a privilege and worthwhile. Surprised you don't know about it. Ask one of Rav Shternbuch's grandsons it seems who was mentioned as organizing it.

The other stuff will just have to play itself out and let's see where all the pieces fall when all the dust settles.

Here is this program with Rav Shternbuch - his voice sounds very old, very English and hard to follow because he is speaking as a Posek and such kind of Rabbanim are very concise and matter of fact about Shaylos, they don't go on and on and on. But the interviewer was gabbing away and trying to "make conversation" with Rav Shternbuch and that sort of trivialized the importance of what Rav Shternbuch was trying to say even though the interviewer David Lichtenstein did speak out in some detail what was going on with the Tamar case and mentioned some background as an introduction.

I see that "Moe Ginsberg" mentions on the post about that ad about the interview that this interviewer David Lichtenstein is on the "liberal side" of the Halachic spectrum which I also thought I picked up on the interview which was a little confusing because Rav Shternbuch was NOT conveying a "liberal" position. For example, the interviewer was trying to get Rav Shternbuch to agree with him that "pre-nups" could be good for Frum couples in America because there is so much divorce going on, and of course Rav Shternbuch objected to that.

So if you get a chance, mention to Rav Shternbuch that he should be more cautious about granting interviews on shows even though the interviewer might agree with Rav Shternbuch on certain points, like the Tamar case, but on the other hand this David Lichtenstein clearly favors pre-nups and he cited all sorts of "Mekoros" to back up his words and agenda, and then Rav Shternbuch answers back and it gets confusing who to believe and what was said and then people may be left with the WRONG impressions that Rav Shternbuch "said" something when he did not, all he did was "speak" with a guy, but did NOT agree with him but was being polite and did not say it strong enough since as a Dayan he speaks in a cold deliberate clinical matter-of-fact way.

But the interviewer stuck in that pre-nups may help to solve the problem of having Agunas, as if he wants to stop the problem of Agunas with pre-nups, and Rav Shternbuch told him that there have always been Agunas and even unmarried women, and that we try to do what we can to help them, each case is different, but if we cannot help them, we just cannot help them. It seems the interviewer had his own agenda and was milking this topic and hoping he could get something out Rav Shternbuch indirectly while siding with the idea that there can be no annulments. It was just an interview with all the risks that comes with it, the person being interviewed is at the mercy of the interviewer, one does not want to be rude and it is hard to know what will come next and how to respond to surprise questions, etc.

The interviewer threw in shaylos about genetically modified fish and was trying to get a "Pesak" from Rav Shternbuch about that, but Rav Shternbuch could not answer clearly because it was a hypothetical question that would come to be "Lema'aseh" in two years and as you know Poskim only answer the immediate Shaylo, they don't Pasken on hypothetical questions about "what might be" or "what could be" or "what will be" in two years time. Rav Shternbuch basically said that it is a Shaylo in Halacha if we go according to the Simanim, or according to the facts, and basically the interviewer was trying to get Rav Shternbuch to say that all genetically changed fish or animals with genes from non-kosher animals should be Assured while Rav Shternbuch answered that while it may be that at some point all Fish may be a problem because of the genetic changes when they add genes from non-kosher fish, but Rav Shternbuch chuckled a bit when he was told it would be a problem in two years time and of course he cannot Pasken on the air as to what would be in two years time.

By the way, the latest Mishpacha has an important interview with Degel HaTorah MK Moshe Gafni and he confirms what I previously posted on your blog that the passing of the latest Israeli budget by a razor thin majority of 61-59 was a victory for removing the dangers of criminalizing those who learn full time. He describes the inner workings of his efforts and the way he has worked as an emissary of Rav Shach, Rav Elyashiv and now Rav Shteinman, and much much more of how a disaster was just averted for the Charedi world in Israel had this fallen through. Very worthwhile article, that even my non-political wife read every word of it and then we had a serious discussion about it which is very unusual because she never focuses on politics, that is my department ;-} Try to get hold of it and post it if you can it is a seminal piece!!!

Be well and have a Freilichen Chanuka!

                          RaP
 ====================================
 Postscript:

The point I am making is that while in the case of the written word, like on this Blog, we can see and read in black and white what is being said and there are no distractions, because "oisiyois machkimois" it is not the same when being interviewed or in a live debate, where there are all sorts of other auditory and visual factors that come into play and can swing debates on STYLE and not on content.

The best known example of this in modern times, is the famous Nixon-Kennedy debates, when on radio and on paper it looked like Nixon had for sure won with his better content and grasp of the facts, but that was not so for those who viewed the debate on TV where Nixon came across as having a "five o' clock shadow" and was sweating and looked jowly and scary, while Kennedy looked the more handsome and charming candidate, something that the Nixon team had not bargained on happening and so Kennedy won on STYLE while Nixon won on SUBSTANCE but lost the 1960 USA presidential election to Kennedy in the end by a very slim margin.

CH"V I am not comparing Rav Shternbuch to "Nixon" but even in the glossy ads advertising the radio shows, Rav Shternbuch is wearing a Shtreimel and looks like the old sage that he is, while Dovid Lichtenstein looks like a cool dude and a "regular guy". And who do you think the crowd that reads Mishpacha and Ami identifies with most? Not the Rav Shternbuch types but it's geared for the modernisha Yeshiva crowd, the so-called "FBCs" "Frum But Cool" (that are the big supporters of the Kaminetskys)! And many of these types are the ones who WANT to have pre-nups and all sorts of Heterim for their fragile and shaky marriages that are increasingly breaking up (it is because today we are dealing with the "me-generation" of spoiled brats who have no clue how to be married and the hard work and Mesirus Nefesh that goes into family-building and running a Torah-true home.) So David Lichtenstein knows who he is speaking for and to, and it is NOT to or for the BADATZ Eidah HaCharedis type crowd that we can be sure of!

It's complicated real-life theater on and off the air and online for that matter and you have to be clever to spot to understand what is really going on!

There is a thing called "ambush journalism" and even "frum" journalists can and do indulge in it to some degree as you can see from this David Lichtenstein character, he sets things up HIS way and then invites Choshuva guests, who may be thinking they are going to get another "Kibbud" (honor) to "speak at the Ommud" but what they are in for is "Bizyones" (abuse) instead!! And then this radio or TV host throws things at them, curve balls, and just by doing that he is getting away with Chutzpa. Because he is acting like a "To'en" (advocate) and not an impartial honest broker who just wants to help Rav Shternbuch convey his message.

Thus Rav Shternbuch and others in that position are forced to fight through the static and run through the gauntlets and well-laid traps that types like Dovid Lichtenstein set for them, and then everything gets confusing, and the listeners who are neither Halachists nor Poskim, do not know what to think. The may easily be misled to think Lichtenstein is just as great a "Lamden" as Rav Shternbuch merely because Lichtenstein cited all sorts of "Mekoros" when he was just showing that he has no Sechel and displaying his Divrei Hevel!

CONCLUSION AND WARNING: Therefore, know that not everyone is smart enough or experienced enough to come away and know what is important and what is not. That they should be listening CAREFULLY to Rav Shternbuch and not to the half baked bobba meises of smarty pants radio or TV hosts.

Protest tonight in Lakewood

Rav Moshe Sternbuch on David Lichtenstein' radio show Dec 5th

Tamar Epstein's Heter: Let's call a spade a spade - The "heter" is based on embarrasing incompetence

Guest post by Ploni

An excellent recent guest post pointed out the difference between the meticulous and transparent way how the Haifa Bais Din went about its business in granting an הפקעת קידושין, as compared to this case.

I believe that it’s time to “call a spade a spade”: This whole supposed “diagnosis” imbroglio is really EMBARRASSING.

Who says? Dr. Allen Frances, who was Chair of the Task Force that published DSM IV in 1994 and before that helped prepare DSM III (published in 1980) and DSM III R (published in 1987).

… Unless, of course our anonymous רופא מומחה knows more than Dr. Frances does.

THIS IS A MATTER OF GROSS INCOMPETENCE, which assumes the illusion that mental health is like any other medical field. Dr. Frances KNOWS otherwise. This is NOT a matter of שיקול הדעת – not even remotely. RABBONIM NEED TO KNOW THIS!

What is necessary is a major campaign to educate the ציבור, including Rabbonim, laymen and the CLINICIANS themselves - who often don't know better.

Here are some examples of what Dr. Frances writes, quoted VERBATIM:

1. "PSYCHIATRIC DIAGNOSIS IS NOT BASED ON ANY PRETENSION OF MEDICAL OR SCIENTIFIC CERTAINTY. It is a descriptive and fallible art, informed by research but RELYING HEAVILY ON SUBJECTIVE JUDGMENTS AND NOT SUPPORTED BY OBJECTIVE BIOLOGICAL TESTS".

2. ... "Before making a diagnosis of mental disorder that will be used for forensic decision-making, a high threshold should be established for what constitutes reliable and valid diagnostic evidence of clinically significant distress or impairment. THE DISTRESS AND IMPAIRMENT SHOULD BE SO EXTENSIVE AND OBVIOUS THAT MOST OR ALL OBSERVERS WOULD AGREE UPON IT. ... Ambiguous cases of possible disorder might qualify for a clinical diagnosis to permit and facilitate treatment but do not necessarily satisfy what should be a much more rigorous forensic standard".

3. ... "The creators of the various versions of the DSM have always been fully aware of the important role it plays in legal proceedings … (e.g., DSM-IV; American Psychiatric Association, 1994; Melton, Petrila, Poythress, & Slobogin, 2007) … but they could not possibly give this one arena their highest priority. THE USES AND POSSIBLE MISUSES OF DSM IN FORENSIC SETTINGS RATE NO HIGHER THAN A DISTANT FOURTH ON THEIR LIST OF PRIORITIES, following well behind DSM's role in clinical care, in research, and in education … inevitable difficulties arise when one manual is used to do so many different purposes" …

4. ... "DSM-III placed this short forensic caution in a prominent place at the front of the book: … The use of this manual for non-clinical purposes, such a determination of legal responsibility, competency or insanity, or justification for third-party payment, must be critically examined in each instance within the appropriate institutional context. (DSM-III, p. 12, American Psychiatric Association, 1980). This caution focused on the nonequivalence of DSM clinical definitions and the requirements of the legal system. … The cautionary statement has been lengthened and included as a separate section starting with DSM-III-R (American Psychiatric Association, 1987). The cautionary statement in DSM-5 (American Psychiatric Association, 2013) is significantly expanded".

5. ... "it is our experience that the diagnoses offered as “expert” testimony are often poorly done, idiosyncratic, and display a disheartening lack of attention to the careful evaluation and documentation of the presence or absence of the specific, pertinent DSM criteria".

6. ... "DSM terms have become so familiar to the mainstream population that THEY CAN SERVE AS CONVENIENT SLURS, SUBJECT TO ONGOING MISINTERPRETATION AND MISUSE IN THE SERVICE OF WHATEVER CURRENT BONE THE PRINCIPALS ARE CHEWING ON. The labels sometimes themselves become the bones. The diagnostic argument joins and aggravates all of the other arguments".

7. ... "Impressionistic, unsupported diagnosis are often inevitable in the rush of ordinary clinical practice, but such SLOPPY DIAGNOSTIC PRACTICE SHOULD HAVE NO ROLE WHATEVER IN FORENSIC WORK WHERE THE STAKES ARE MUCH HIGHER AND THERE EXISTS TIME AND RESOURCES FOR A THOROUGH EVALUATION".

8. ... "the psychiatric diagnosis may actually be WORSE THAN WORTHLESS since inaccurate psychiatric diagnosis is very misleading in legal decision-making".

9. ... "Custody battles can become the most painful, disorienting, and distressing of human experiences. The diagnostic evaluations typically take place at the worst period in the lives of the principals and often bring out the worst in them. BREAKUP OF A FAMILY IS A TREMENDOUS STRESS TO ALL CONCERNED AND CAUSES SYMPTOMS THAT MAY NOT BE TYPICAL OF THE INDIVIDUALS' PAST OR FUTURE FUNCTIONING … Even those who are usually resilient during times of great difficulty may now become anxious, sad, angry, scared, erratic, on a rollercoaster of emotions and impulsivity … Whatever are their usual cognitive and behavioral tendencies will be exaggerated … EVALUATORS MUST TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THAT PARTICIPANTS ARE OFTEN PRESENTING AT THEIR WORST"…

10. ... "The DSM's caveat that there are “significant risks that diagnostic information will be misused or misunderstood” is NOWHERE MORE APROPOS THAN IN CUSTODY BATTLES".

Source:

Frances, A., & Halon, R. (2013). The uses and misuses of the DSM in forensic settings. Psychological Injury and Law, 6(4), 336-34