Sunday, August 20, 2023

Rabbi Akiva Eiger - like all gedolim - needed to make a mistake to show he was human

This is a first hand report that was sent to me by someone I know
I am reporting a story I heard from Rav Avrohom Turin shlit”a, mashgiach in Yeshiva Bais Moshe Scranton. There is a known question from Reb Akiva Eiger in which he inquires how it is that a man can be together with his wife when she is pregnant, if she is carrying a girl, then he violates אשה ובתה. Reb Akiva Eiger poses an answer, but doesn’t accept it in conclusion.

When the bochurim in Telshe in Europe were learning a related sugya, they encountered this tshuvah, and were perplexed. Firstly, they considered the question foolish, then they wondered how he offered the teretz he did, then how he remained inconclusive at the end. The bochurim attacked this with a vengeance. How did Reb Akiva Eiger consider this a valid question, what is the real teretz, and why did he not consider that teretz, etc. Needless to say, the bais hamedrash was buzzing with this issue for days. The Rosh Hayeshiva  came in to say shuir, and immediately acknowledged that the preoccupation with this issue needed to be addressed. Here is what he said.

"Reb Akiva Eiger was pronounced dead by his doctors some 15 years before he actually died. During that time, he wrote voluminous chidushei Torah, tshuvos in intricate areas of halacha, and said great shiurim. Observing this, one might conclude that Reb Akiva Eiger was not a human but a malach! That, proclaimed the Rosh Hayeshivah, would not be good. One cannot consider a malach a potential role model. Only a great human can serve as a role model. Every Yid has the potential to achieve greatness, and use of role models for this is a critical aspect of Avodas Hashem. In order to recognize that a great human is truly human, they must be known to have erred. Imperfection is uniquely human. So HKB”H arranges that every tzaddik makes one mistake so that we should know he is human. This was that mistake for Reb Akiva Eiger."

13 comments :

  1. I think the kashya is from a teshuvas RAE and the way he asked the question is if the child is a boy it should be mishkav zachar if I recall.

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  2. Lakewood Yeshiva GuyNovember 1, 2015 at 4:29 PM

    That Rosh Yeshiva, if the story is true, is an Apikorus and Baal Gaavah on the level of Frankfurter from the Ami.

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  3. I'd be more convinced RAE made a mistake if the error was in print.

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  4. You're an idiot on the level of ... on the level of ... on the level of ...

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  5. Another story of a Chochom (Rosh Yeshiva) questioning another Chochom. Not a layman attacking the position or action of a Chochom.

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  6. Please cite sources that justify your statement. I assume that your diviculty is with specifying the error not the claim that he made a mistake?

    If not please tell me the source of believing that Achronim are infallible? Rav Moshe Feinstein acknowledged that he was not infallible.

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  7. And the Kavah Kashysoh - chelkas yoav -
    קבא דקשייתא
    discusses if you hold u'bar lav yerech imo whether or how a pregnant woman can go out on shabbos (for the Israelis,in a place with no eiruv.

    That's what lomdus is all about.

    Typical story with an unnamed Rosh Yeshiva. Don't believe any Rosh Yeshiva would talk about Rabbi Akiva Eiger in that way (it would be put more diplomatically, if at all).

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  8. In fact there is a sugyo in Sanhedrin who discusses whether a mushchas (presumably) can commit mishkov zochor with himself. Even though it is biologically impossible. Ein Kaan Mokom Leharich.

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  9. Lakewood Yeshiva GuyNovember 1, 2015 at 8:30 PM

    Why are you drawing a line at Achronim? Why not Rishonim?
    Amoraim? Tanaim???
    Then i guess throw in that Amoraim suffered from depression???
    Where do you stand with Torah after that????


    Watch where you go Rabbi Eidensohn

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  10. Lakewood Guy - do you learn in Yeshiva? Does it matter whether you have sources for your assertions? Or do you think can be a bully by throwing around the word apikorus?

    Don't tell the Torah what is contains but try and learn what the Torah has to say. Where does it say leaders are infallible?

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  11. My gut feeling - this story as presented never happened and is a "sanitized" version of a story that the Rav told about his grandfather Rav Chaim, noted in the Mesorah journal here on p46 -
    https://oukosher.org/content/uploads/2012/12/mes-6.pdf



    The story would have had to be sanitized in order to avoid mention of Rav Soloveitchik, so Rav Chaim was switched out for an unnamed Telzer Rosh Yeshiva. I am not accusing Rav Tuirn of this "censorship" but this may have happened somewhere along the way, with he himself being told the altered version of the story.


    Again, just a gut feeling. If anyone has the R Akiva Eiger with the footnotes, it's siman 172, the kashya is based on the gemara that vlad hanirvaas hi uvlada are asurim bc hi uvlada nirbeu, so if it's a daughter then ba al bito, if it's a boy, it's mishkav zachar.

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  12. "Reb Akiva Eiger was pronounced dead by his doctors some 15 years before he actually died. During that time, he wrote voluminous chidushei Torah, tshuvos in intricate areas of halacha, and said great shiurim"



    What does that mean?

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  13. Um your ein kan makom lihaarich is "haariched" in the selfsame gemara you quote and does discuss the biological possibility ayin sham.

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