Washington Post The mother of a 13-year-old girl allegedly raped at a Tulsa megachurch is suing the church for waiting two weeks to report the allegation.
The lawsuit — first reported by the Tulsa World — was filed Friday in Tulsa County District Court. It seeks more than $75,000 and alleges that Victory Christian Center officials tried to conceal the allegation in an effort at “damage control.”
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kjrh Another possible victim has come forward with accusations of sexual
misconduct against former Victory Christian Center employee Chris
Denman, the fourth involving a former church employee in recent months.
The
12-year-old girl is the third minor to bring claims of sexual abuse
against Denman. Denman, 20, was arrested Sept. 5 for raping a
13-year-old girl at a church event and molesting a 15-year-old girl.
The original allegations against the former church intern have
ignited a firestorm in recent weeks as six other Victory Christian
employees have been arrested -- one Israel Castillo for making a lewd
proposal to a minor and using a computer to facilitate a sex crime and
five others for failure to report child abuse.
Among the five
were John Daugherty, Victory Christian youth pastor and son of senior
pastor Sharon Daugherty, and wife Charica Daugherty.
A lawsuit filed by one of the alleged victims' parents also accuses Sharon Daugherty of having knowledge.
R. Eidensohn,
ReplyDeleteIt seems to me you are focusing very much on the horrors of child abuse on your blog. But not so much on the horrors of CPS abuse of parents or even the abusive family court system. I believe this creates a false impression that much more needs to be done to counter abuse but without recognizing the hell the out of control social service CPS/Family Court agencies can put people through on the flimsiest of excuses and motivated by clear finaicial conflict of interest. All in the name of protecting children from abuse when it doesn't even exist. (Included would be the false memories of abuse that therapists convinced adults they experienced as children etc.) It implicitly casts a poor light on rabbonim who try to balance these factors. You also seem to paint therapists/social service workers as the good guys in this drama - but I suspect that isn't really so much the case. I would appreciate a serious treatment of these other issues to present a more balanced picture of this difficult problem. Then it will come off less like propaganda and more like I believe you intend it to be. Yashar Koach to you and your brother for attempting to improve things for all of us.
mike
Mike, I think that there is a big lack of consciousness on these issues that you mention. For anyone that is interested to understand more about the history of this whole issue, I suggest reading the book Satan's Silence by Debbie Nathan and Michael Snedeker. Israel is 30 years behind the times on this subject and what you are speaking of is just beginning to hit Jerusalem now. Apparently, the lessons from the 80s and 90s in America are not transferable to Israel and they will need to learn the hard way as is being witnessed in Jerusalem at the present time. Hopefully, Rav Eidensohn will make the effort to also investigate the problems you are referring to and bring an awareness of these issues to the general public.
DeleteMike, as I'm sure you know, the Ultra-Orthodox lifestyle is very different then the lifestyle of our non-Orthodox neighbors. Thus the Orthodox Jewish communities have found it neccesary over the years to create their own support orginizations for various different issues, rather then to utilize the help of orginizations already in place by the non-Orthodox world. Thus we have Hatzalah, Shomrim etc.
DeleteI believe that given the uniqueness of our communities, issues of child abuse is one that the Ultra-Orthodox communities really should have their own orginizations in place to deal with it "in the community," rather then utilize govenment agencies set up for this porpuse.
However, sadly over the years we have come to realize that that is just not happening, and relying on internal organizations and Rabbonim to deal with it is equivelant to not dealing with the problem at all.
Thus, due to lack of choice we are forced to involve Child Services to try to help protect our children.
This is for sure not an ideal solution given that Child Services is sometimes so clueless about our lifestyles, yet it surely is better then just ignoring the issue.
Perhaps the solution is for us as a community to finally take a firm stand to really choose to stop molestation regardless what the personal costs might be, and then work together with Child Services. Perhaps that would also decrease the amount of false allegations we see.
but I do think that rather then potray this as an issue that has two sides to be balanced, we need to take responsability for our failures in this matter; since if we were dealing with this correctly on the inside, I don't believe we would be seeing Child Services meddling into our families in situations where it is totally unwaranted.
Mike. If false abuse problems occurred as often as cover-ups you would have a valid criticism. However, estimates of false accusations are in the range of 1-3% and false convictions are much less common than that because there are high quality investigations these days between accusations and proceeding to prosecutions. In contrast, probably 95% of all charedi child abuse is not reported to authorities. Even when it is reported victims and their families are often intimidated out of proceeding through trial.
ReplyDeleteSo in our current world most of our effort should go into correcting the imbalance by getting more abuse crimes into the criminal justice system. If/when most abuse cases are reported and there is a rise in false accusations, I would certainly favor a shift in efforts by advocates like Rabbi Eidensohn. I suspect he would agree with what I say.
There was a very interesting back and forth on comments in my blog about this issue involving myself and Benzion Twerski. If you are in rush go to the end of comments, because as our debate proceded his postion changed or perhaps was clarified in the shalah vtaryah.
Agreed. I have in fact have posted about cases of false accusations. Cases such as the gym teacher in New Jersey who was false accused. But as mentioned- coverups are much more common in the frum community than false accusaations and incompetent handling by social workers and police.
DeleteI have also mentioned that going to a rabbi and avoiding secular authorities is no guarantee of protection against false accusations. I have mentioned a number of times the case in Lakewood 10 years ago where a wife - on the advise of her divorce lawyer - accused her husband of abusing the kids. She was supported by the rabbinic establishment of Lakewood against her husband. Several years ago she publicly admitted that her accusations were false. Divorce proceedings are a significant source of false accusations.
Similarly the rabbinic pronouncements concerning Nachliot and other cases - do not necessarily correspond to reality and do not necessarily protect the children.
I also mention this problem in my book - and Rav Leff reiterated it his presentation which I have linked to at the top of the blog.
Bottom line - if you have been reading this blog on a regular basis then you are aware of the problem. However the alternative is problematic. A better approach - which in fact exists in a number of communities is to have the police CPS and rabbis working together. This is described in the article about Rabbi Silman's program in Bnei Brak.
http://daattorah.blogspot.co.il/2008/12/child-abuse-treatment-in-chareidi.html
"Similarly the rabbinic pronouncements concerning Nachliot and other cases - do not necessarily correspond to reality and do not necessarily protect the children."
DeleteDear Rabbi,
Could you clarify what you mean by this Thanks
/
Delete"Similarly the rabbinic pronouncements concerning Nachliot and other cases - do not necessarily correspond to reality and do not necessarily protect the children."
Dear Rabbi,
You seem to be implying that there are Rabbinic pronouncements about Nachlaot that are incorrect. Could you please elaborate on which Rabbinic pronouncements you are talking about and exactly what you mean? Thank you.
I would like to but can't. Bottom line the situation is much messier and bizarre then the press has reported.
DeleteThese answers seem very odd to me. How is it possible to know what one, by definition, one does't know. I sense alot of assuming going on. I also sense a general undercurrent of feminism (by far the greatest threat to Torah today) by certain of the commentators here. In a system where burden of proof must rest on the accuser, I fear that blogs like this are actually, de facto, militating for the burden of the accused to prove his innocence. Furthermore, I don't know of even one divorce case, and I am personally aware of several, both Orthodox and other, that did not involve charges of sexual abuse or violence on the part of the woman. I also don't believe studies by politically correct academics (is there any other kind these days?) because they seem like 'group think' to me rather than a search for truth. I'm afraid that without the balance I am advocating, the good intentions of the author of this blog will yield some very awful unexpected consequences. As the man said, after being exonerated from a false accusation - 'where do I go to get my reputation back'.
ReplyDeleteOy Mike,
Deletedo you know any victims of molestation or incest? Have you had any first hand experince with these matters?
You ask "How is it possible to know what one, by definition, one does't know."
Well quite simply, if you know the subject well by following cases for some years and studying the matter by listening to what victims say, then you would realize one can and does know.
When you say these are stuff by definition one can't know, I assume the only thing you would consider enough proof is if the perpetrator was wittnessed commiting his sins before two adult males, (excluding the victime of course,) and who knows, perhaps you would also require that he be warned beforehand??........
The problem with your approach is that there is someone on the other side, the victim, who is really being made to suffer if one accepts your views. This isn't a subject where one can just sit passively on the sidelines and say, "well since we can never know FOR SURE then lets just let the whole thing go."
By the way, I would also love to understand what you mean by "feminism being by far the greatest threat to Torah today."
Oy Mike,
Deletedo you know any victims of molestation or incest? Have you had any first hand experince with these matters?
----
No. But I am not saying to do less than you are doing in combatting this evil. Just to add the balance that I am suggesting. There are no easy decisions in this case, but by only emphasizing one side, you can create a reign of terror lead by 'therapists' and cps workers and 'do gooders'. No one is more dangerous than the 'do gooder'.
The day 'therapists' cozy up with CPS is the day we stay very far away from therapists.
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BGhh7MEGKI
Mike on what basis on you asserting that I am not giving a balanced picture? On what basis are you claiming that the above video is representative of those who investigate child abuse? You report that you sense various concerns - but you bring no evidence whether these concerns are typically or rare occurences.
DeleteThe issue facing the Orthodox community is whether to report abuse or not. By creating a false equivalence (balance) between the harm of coverups and the harm of reporting - you are not helping.
It is like arguing that the dangers of not vaccinating your child have to be balanced with the dangers of the vaccination - in a situation the harm from vaccinations is significantly less than the harm of not vaccinating.
There are concerns which I have reported such as in Brooklyn a frum cop told me - never call Boro Park police to report abuse - because the charges will be dismissed within 10 minutes because of community activists. He said always call the sex crimes division where there are well trained investigators. So yes it is important to know what is the best way to deal with the situation - but not to give an excuse for doing nothing.
I'm not giving an excuse for doing nothing. Your academic studies mean nothing to me for the reason I stated. Your anecdotal evidence is matched by my acquaintances that are CPS and social workers.
ReplyDeleteBy all means, do what you can to combat abuse. And the Almighty should reward you for your efforts. But don't pretend very heavy, and very difficult decisions are really straightforward becuase you have a bunch of ideologically motivated academics giving you 'statictics' about studies of false abuse claims. And that somehow threapists and social workers are experts and objective. But that, in general,rabbonim, who try to balance the various issues are clueless.
Mike perhaps you would like to share some stories about how Rabbis handled pedophiles in a superior way to the social workers? Or how they used their superior knowledge of psychology to prevent false accusations? Or how coverups and throwing the victim of abuse out of beis Yaakov shows superior knowledge of abuse?
DeleteNo. I would like to share how much unchecked and unbalanced power these people have. And how power corrupts. There are very many websites that offer anectdotal evidence, much like on your site. Try google. Here's one. http://fairfaxcps.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2011-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&updated-max=2012-01-01T00:00:00-08:00&max-results=8
DeleteUntil you take these concerns seriously, and don't try to steamroll over them or pooh pooh them, I hope the community activists don't rest getting accused abusers released. Until your coalitition of groups that should cooperate (you mentioned rabbonnim, cps and police working together) includes the activists that represent the fear of this type of abuse of power, I believe your group is incomplete and doesn't deserve support at all. Encounter the leaders of the community activists and find a way to address their concerns and bring them in. You will have done a very difficult thing, but I believe a necessary one before you can be effecitive without bringing about a greater evil.
The tzar was evil and the early communists had decent ideals. The results were tragic.
Mike I understand your concerns and basically agree with you. Instead of continuing this discussion - why don't you write a guest post?
DeleteRabbi Eidenson,
DeleteI don't have the time to do justice to this topic in a guest post. I am not really directing my comments at your readership and am not willing to engage them. I am only addressing you. Because I appreciate your brother and yourself and the work you are doing. Sometimes an outsider may notice, in a broad general way, what those who are close to a thing don't notice. I am pointing out an effect your blog may have based on the overall impression it makes on me, based on headline and choice of topic. Not simply the words that are used or what you actually believe. I would guess that you are not the person I am worried about. But a kosher person like yourself, espcecially like yourself, could in fact break the way through for many who would follow you that would not be kosher. My comments are directed to you in the spirit of 'a word to the wise'. I agree that no further discussion is warrented. You should see Hatzlacha!
Mike this video is really disappointing; better said, it's just a waste of time, since it includes no testimonials, and nothing of substance. The creator doesn't even show us who he is, but rather hides behind some caricature.
ReplyDeleteWell perhaps it conveys the fears that one who needs to go through an inspection by the CPS experiences; and yes, there probably are innocent families that are subjected to this nuisance and discomfort.
But the real question is, "what percentage of innocent families fail the inspection and actually get convicted of child abuse unfairly?" It seems to me that perhaps anyone can get an inspection to be opened on anybody, but since the inspection is quite thorough, (which is perhaps why it’s so uncomfortable,) most of the time the truth will prevail.
Actually, I'm just remembering a friend of mine whose doctor opened a case against her. While she found the experience to be very unnerving, she did say once the Social Worker realized there really was no abuse going on, she was really nice to her and really helped her just get the case closed and move on with her life.
So I believe we need to choose between bothering innocent parents by having them go through an inspection verses ignoring real issues of child abuse and incest. I think it should be clear to us which would be the moral path to take.
And as mentioned before, if only the Rabbonim and Askonim would really take a strong stand against real abuse and incest, I believe they would be able to work nicely together with CPS and thus there would be fewer instances of innocent parents being harassed. We need to remember that practically “all” molesters will swear that they are innocent, yet if the Rabbonim and Askonim would only listen to the evidence without being partial, and learn a thing or two about incest they would easily be able to identify those cases where intervention is a must.
" the real question is, "what percentage of innocent families fail the inspection and actually get convicted of child abuse unfairly?" It seems to me that perhaps anyone can get an inspection to be opened on anybody, but since the inspection is quite thorough, (which is perhaps why it’s so uncomfortable,) most of the time the "
DeleteFordaas,
I am glad that your friend was able to move on with her life. What I think you don't understand is the extent of the problem that Mike is trying to convey. You may want to look up on line about an organization in the States called fmsf or False Memory Syndrome Foundation. I don't have the current figures for families that are affected but old figures put the number of families affected at 16000 in the U.S. and 8000 in England. As a result of the efforts of this organization and other individuals, the amount of new cases has dropped significantly.
Also through the efforts of certain people and organizations, the plague of accusations of Satanic Ritual abuse was laid to rest. The last major outbreak was in 1994 in Washington State where 60 people were accused. What is happenning in Nachlaot is a mutation of the Satanic Ritual abuse cases. With parents and social workers and police using leading questions in their interrogations of the children. Do you realize that over 40 innocent people have been accused there and more innocent people are still being added to the list through the efforts of
a few people.
As for your question, a person does not need to be indicted to have his or her life destroyed. It is enough to just be accused. Even though the accusations in Nachlaot border on the impossible, the accusations were and still are believed by many people. The biggest doubters of these accusations are the people who live in the immediate area of these accusations that are not amongst the few families that believe the stories of the children.
I'll admit I know little about these incidents. But perhaps you can elaborate a bit on what are the methods these organizations use to minimize, and hopefully eliminate false accusations? Perhaps we too can employ them.
DeleteBut to quote Mike in his response to Rabbi Eidensohn elsewhere in this thread;
"Until you take these concerns seriously, and don't try to steamroll over them or pooh pooh them, I hope the community activists don't rest getting accused abusers released."
I find this statement extremely troubling. It is equivalent to demanding that we stop prosecuting murder cases altogether since we believe there are some that were falsely accused.
In addition I have spoken to Rabbis myself, and witnessed their refusal to help victims even in cases where they admitted they believed the perpetrator was known to them not to be a trustworthy individual. Their refusal came mostly because of their discomfort to deal with this stuff. I would be very surprised to learn that their “efforts” actually helped innocent people from being prosecuted.
Also, Rabbi Edenton’s fair question to Mike has been ignored. Rabbi Eidensohn asked; “Mike perhaps you would like to share some stories about how Rabbis handled pedophiles in a superior way to the social workers? Or how they used their superior knowledge of psychology to prevent false accusations?”
Though I too do believe that some activists in their fervor to set this problem straight somehow, tend to scream fire as soon as they might even just imagine they are smelling smoke. Thus each case needs to be evaluated individually, and cautiously.