They state:The Role of Tiferes Bais Yisrael
Proper guidance is crucial when a non-Jewish spouse sincerely seeks a halachic conversion.
To assure full acceptance into any Jewish educational system or community throughout the world, including Israel, the conversion must adhere to the requirements and standards of Jewish law, as established by recognized Torah authorities.
TBY assists intermarried couples who display a sincere and strong commitment to live a Jewish lifestyle, in accordance with Torah and halacha.
In this situation, the Jewish spouse is becoming a fully observant Jew while the non-Jewish partner is committed to become a sincere and fully observant convert.
Does the Emperor have new clothes, or is it the same raw deal with new marketing and a new brand name?
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
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ReplyDeleteIs it led by a rabbi whose name sounds like Leif Flopper?
ReplyDeleteCrazy!
ReplyDeleteBut what can you do. The new/old "International Chairman" is the same old/new Thomas Kaplan, as they advertize their "Staff".
No self-respect. They are still trying to do the impossible, to get all batei din to be under their control which cannot be done until the Mashiach comes.
Rabbi Ehrentrau is getting his handle on Europe, fine. Israel has the Rabbanut and various other Halachic authorities like the BADATS of the Eidah. America cannot and will never be "tamed" as it's too big with too many splits. The Modern Orthodox RCA, the Satmar CRC, the various Chabad factions, and all the local and far-flung batei din will never have or submit to "one" standard. So this is an exercise in futility.
The amazing thing is that Thomas Kaplan refuses to learn from his mistakes. Has he never heard of "once bitten, twice shy"? He threw money into Tropper's coffers and look what he got, sexcapades and scandals, he even lost his family, his sister and her son Guma Aguiar who is evidently still languishing in Israel. Tropper caused all this misery under the guise of EJF, so how can a change of name to "TBY" (who makes up these names, why not call it "Conversions, Inc" or "Giur Corp"), as if this is the "new Coke" a strategy that also failed.
What a pity that now reams of good money will be going down the drain with useless exercises that lead to nowhere and achieve nothing. (Who will supervise the dayanim while they in those fancy hotels again? What's to stop another Troppergate from happening again?)
Why do I think it's going to take a stake thru the heart to finally kill off the EJF-Tropper-Kaplan zombie?
ReplyDeleteI really thought they were down and out for good!
We can only hope that no one will show up. But if he can pull this off then Tropper will know that he is never stoppable. It is sad that the Monsey bet din settled for his leaving town instead of making it clear that he can not be trusted in any rabbinic role in any place.
ReplyDeleteWhat are the considerations and possibilities of putting this dangerous man in cherem?
Who is backing him besides Kaplan?
Where is he living and davening these days?
I can only hope that next time anyone goes after him they do not settle for any half measures.
I notice that they list R. Reuvain Feinstein as head of their halachic committee. Can this be true.
ReplyDeleteI also notice that LT himself does not appear on the list of people himself.
Clearly it has the whiff of his tumah. But is it remotely possible that this is EJF but without Tropper himself?
re: We can only hope that no one will show up.
ReplyDeletePerhaps we should do the reverse - have many bnei Torah show up, en mass, and give voice publicaly (no matter which head of Yeshiva is sitting in the dais! ;) that what they are doing is wrong! That should close them down!
What a bunch of double speak!
ReplyDeletere: "SAFEGUARDING THE SANCTITY OF THE JEWISH FAMILY"???
I would have thought that one safeguards precious things by LOCKING the doors - not throwing them wide open!
re: "TBY is committed to preserving kedushas Yisroel from assimilation and intermarriage"???
Really? How do you do that? By giving classes and lectures around the USA on the dangers of "assimilation and intermarriage"? By providing quality outreach bnei Torah speakers to travel from city to city to inspire unaffiliated Jews to re-examine their heritage? Perhaps by having Mr. Kaplan fund Jewish Outreach programs in cities around the USA so that Jews will return to Torah and NOT intermarry?
I just checked their "Programing" on their website (http://www.tbyisrael.org/) - no such programs!
Wouldn't you think these are appropriate methods of "preserving kedushas Yisroel from assimilation and intermarriage"??? TBY is clearly more 'diluting' Kedushas Yisroel through post-facto conversions so that 'statistically' we can adjust down the the numbers of intermarriage!
As before - this is nothing new! Same sham - new name!
PS. Same Executive Director as EJF - Rabbi Dovid Jacobs
ReplyDeleteRe: Yerachmiel Lopin
ReplyDeleteTropper has nothing to do with EJF/TBY, although he's still buddies with Tom, who must be nuts, despite being a gazzillionaire (sounds like Guma...Hmmm). Leibeleh commits unspeakable atrocities on your dime, and you can't let go. Sad.
Despite signing the document, Tropper still lives in Monsey, same house on Grove Street. He even davened Neilah for the amud at the Krohns on Yom Kippur. The feckless Monsey Rabbinate is shamed beyond description.
As for davening, he never davened with a minyan. Never. Ask anyone who knows him. Ask anyone who has ever been in the yeshiva. He used to claim that he went to shul Mondays and Thursdays for laining, but later proven to be a liar.
He also has a new blog, ironically named kavodhatora.com (I guess it's better than chillulshaimshamaimbferhesia.com), where he espouses his same-old garbage. BTW, one recent post justifies his not going to hear leining. He bashes the current Kol Yaakov administration. He even goes so far as to take a not-so-subtle dig at R' Shternbuch, shlit"a.
The whole thing is sickening.
Tropper 1, Klal Yisrael 0.
PS If you need enough cirumstantial evidence to convince you that kavodhatora belongs to Tropper, just ask.
PS If you need enough cirumstantial evidence to convince you that kavodhatora belongs to Tropper, just ask.
ReplyDeletePlease provide such evidence.
Give them a chance, guys. Tropper hates them now because they "stole" Kaplan's support. His - and his buddies - are gone. David Jacobs rejected him once the scandal broke and pushed him out. They brought in Rav Viener who is a respected, mainstream T'Chacham to lead the organization. they're not doing any couples' weekends in fancy hotels.
ReplyDeletesounds like they are trying to hit the restart button...I wait and see
To Anon @ 11:17
ReplyDeleteWait and see what? Were back to the same old issues. WHY?! Why have an organized "outreach" to intermarried yidden?
I know firsthand from an ehrliche Rav who does kiruv that he asked Rav Shach, when come across an intermarried couple should he put forth effort to be mekarev them? Rav Shach said "no! Use your kochos where they can more readily accomplish - where there is no non-Jewish partner that is an in automatic challenge to kiruv efforts. Unless they come to YOU first - then you can work with them."
And who asked TBY to be God's bahelfer (assistant) to establish "universal guidelines" for anything?! Such guidelines already exist - it is called Shulchan Orech Yoreh deah!
No my friend - this is just the same shochad takers of Kaplan's money - with a new name (and the same Rosh Yeshiva!) VERY SAD! :(
Samuel,
ReplyDeleteOK. This may take more than one post.
Remember: all evidence is circumstantial. BTW, there's no doubt that Tropper himself doesn't do the actual posting. He is technically illiterate. He only uses his Blackberry. He doesn't even have a computer. But the content is written and provided by him.
1. The blog was formed Wednesday, December 16, 2009, just 2 days after his downfall. The stated objective of the site is "to restore the honor of talmidei chachamim, as the sin of scorning Talmidei Chachamim is too great to bear".
2. The first blog is about a rabbi annulling marriages.
3. The second blog is about how bad internet gossip is.
4. The post of Sunday, February 7, 2010 is all about three of the rabbanim who were against him. See here: http://www.kavodhatora.com/2010_02_01_archive.html
5. The only Monsey Rav he talks about with any respect is R' Schlesinger, see here: http://www.kavodhatora.com/2010/08/hagaon-harav-yisroel-d-schlesinger.html
6. There are two posts about Kol Yaakov, both strongly opposed to the current administration and both full of lies, see here: http://www.kavodhatora.com/2010/08/tumult-of-kol-yaakov.html
and here: http://www.kavodhatora.com/2010/10/harav-dovid-wolpin-shlita-mashgiach-of.html
He is the only one in the world (along with a small handful of cronies like Nachman Kramer) who feels this way about Kol Yaakov. Everyone else is either supportive of his ouster (really his resignation) or ambivalent.
7. He speaks about R' Aaron Shechter and R' Elya Ber Wachtfogel as if they're the only Roshei Yeshiva in America.
8. In an article about R' Shach, he mentions that R' Schach's rebbe was R' Leib Forer from Holyoke, Mass., who is his grandfather. No one else would even know that, or care.
9. The only two yeshivas that he mentions are the ones in Cliffwood Lake (Rabbi Alster) and Boston (Rabbi Wilhelm), which happen to be the two yeshivas his son, Tzvi Pesach, went to.
10. He speaks very fondly of Rabbi J.B. Soloveitchik. He would become livid if anyone mentioned anything negative against R' J.B. and would dedicate entire Shabbos Drashos to upholding his honor. He knew that the yeshiva world didn't hold of R' J.B., but he wouldn't constantly try to explain how the gedolim really held of him.
11. The subtle dig against R' Shternbuch here: http://www.kavodhatora.com/2010/10/halachic-disussion.html
12. The entire flavor and style of writing, without writing people's full names, not writing full or coherent sentences, the choice of words just smacks of Tropper. I guess if you don't know him, that doesn't mean much, but for those who know him, and especially for those who are close to him, the shoe definitely fits.
If I think of anything else, I'll let you know.
Samuel,
ReplyDeleteOK. This may take more than one post.
Remember: all evidence is circumstantial. BTW, there's no doubt that Tropper himself doesn't do the actual posting. He is technically illiterate. He only uses his Blackberry. He doesn't even have a computer. But the content is written and provided by him.
1. The blog was formed Wednesday, December 16, 2009, just 2 days after his downfall. The stated objective of the site is "to restore the honor of talmidei chachamim, as the sin of scorning Talmidei Chachamim is too great to bear".
2. The first blog is about a rabbi annulling marriages.
3. The second blog is about how bad internet gossip is.
4. The post of Sunday, February 7, 2010 is all about three of the rabbanim who were against him. See here: http://www.kavodhatora.com/2010_02_01_archive.html
5. The only Monsey Rav he talks about with any respect is R' Schlesinger, see here: http://www.kavodhatora.com/2010/08/hagaon-harav-yisroel-d-schlesinger.html
6. There are two posts about Kol Yaakov, both strongly opposed to the current administration and both full of lies, see here: http://www.kavodhatora.com/2010/08/tumult-of-kol-yaakov.html
ReplyDeleteand here: http://www.kavodhatora.com/2010/10/harav-dovid-wolpin-shlita-mashgiach-of.html
He is the only one in the world (along with a small handful of cronies like Nachman Kramer) who feels this way about Kol Yaakov. Everyone else is either supportive of his ouster (really his resignation) or ambivalent.
7. He speaks about R' Aaron Shechter and R' Elya Ber Wachtfogel as if they're the only Roshei Yeshiva in America.
8. In an article about R' Shach, he mentions that R' Schach's rebbe was R' Leib Forer from Holyoke, Mass., who is his grandfather. No one else would even know that, or care.
9. The only two yeshivas that he mentions are the ones in Cliffwood Lake (Rabbi Alster) and Boston (Rabbi Wilhelm), which happen to be the two yeshivas his son, Tzvi Pesach, went to.
10. He speaks very fondly of Rabbi J.B. Soloveitchik. He would become livid if anyone mentioned anything negative against R' J.B. and would dedicate entire Shabbos Drashos to upholding his honor. He knew that the yeshiva world didn't hold of R' J.B., but he wouldn't constantly try to explain how the gedolim really held of him.
11. The subtle dig against R' Shternbuch here: http://www.kavodhatora.com/2010/10/halachic-disussion.html
12. The entire flavor and style of writing, without writing people's full names, not writing full or coherent sentences, the choice of words just smacks of Tropper. I guess if you don't know him, that doesn't mean much, but for those who know him, and especially for those who are close to him, the shoe definitely fits.
If I think of anything else, I'll let you know.
You all got it wrong! TBY formally EJF had nothing to do with Tropper's scandal..The cause and the work they did was commendable. Now they are refreshing their efforts with less pomp and more quality. Tropper is gone! he is in his own exile..Has nothing to do with TBY whatsoever. Just because President Clinton messed up, doesnt mean that the office of the presidency should be destroyed! People make many mistakes and pay with consequences to their actions but why should the Institution go down as well?
ReplyDeleteI checked out that "kovad hatora" blog website. One thing is for sure...Whoever writes or edits the posts are lacking basic language speaking and writing skills.
ReplyDeleteI also noticed that there are 0 comments to all posts. The author of this site does not identify him or herself. Any anonymous site is not worth reading. Many would not spend time to read it.or answer to it..It seems that JewishMad's speculations and circumstantial evidence is correct.
Another one:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.kavodhatora.com/2010_02_01_archive.html
im so happy there will be an org to deal with the yu/mada community bais din's leberal standards for addmitting into klal yisroel
ReplyDeletemay we all have the protection to keap klak yisroel pure and holy with out compromises in halacha and hashkafa
If you search the blog for comments by careful you will find out comments where he defends Tropper and claims that that Guma is behind the doctoring of the tapes.
ReplyDeleteDovid Jacob is talmid muvhak of Tropper and would not do anything without his approval. The thing is still runs by Tropper.
We will see how corrupted is this generation's leaders when they run to TBY willing to do an anything for grants.
Yes, the blog praises many times the harav hagaon Leib Tropper Shlita, and he still does not like these 3 bloggers: Daat Torah, Rav Mendlowitz and the Failed Messiah.
ReplyDeletewho is mendlowitz?
ReplyDeletePoster "JewishMad" should be thanked for revealing that Tropper has been secretly running an attack blog since December of 2009, almost a year now, and nobody noticed. As "JewishMad" tell us above:
ReplyDelete"He also has a new blog, ironically named kavodhatora.com (I guess it's better than chillulshaimshamaimbferhesia.com), where he espouses his same-old garbage. BTW, one recent post justifies his not going to hear leining. He bashes the current Kol Yaakov administration. He even goes so far as to take a not-so-subtle dig at R' Shternbuch, shlit"a.
The whole thing is sickening.
Tropper 1, Klal Yisrael 0.
PS If you need enough cirumstantial evidence to convince you that kavodhatora belongs to Tropper, just ask."
And by now, as others familiar with Tropper's style look over that sordid blog, it is undoubtedly Tropper.
Here is something else that catches the eye, how Tropper attacks the Monsey rabbis who led the way in defrocking him and evicting him from his posts, see this one for example, only the fourth post in that blog first three months:
(NOTE, all spelling errors are those of the original post, but the message is very odd): "R'Dovid Ribiat, R' Pinchas Rabinowitz and R' ben tzion Kokis Of monsey, NY Ignore the Psak of Maran Harav Steinman shlita (Sunday, February 7, 2010) In an unprecedented act of Defiance of a Gadol Hador, Three Rabbi's in Monsey went on A Slander campaign against a Talmid Chochom. Meny Gdolim in Eretz Yiroel and America are shocked by this conuct. A meeting of Gedolei Roshei yeshvot is scheduled for next week. For the immediate the Tzibur of Bnei Torah should distance themselves from the above 3 Rabbiws."
1) The 3 rabbis are well know but do they belong in one grouping and if so why? What is "In an unprecedented act of Defiance of a Gadol Hador, Three Rabbi's in Monsey went on A Slander campaign against a Talmid Chochom" all about? Is it because of their involvement with the Tropper case in any way (if that is the "Talmid Chochom" in question, which it seems to be), and why are they being counter-slandered on a blog devoted to "fighting slander of rabbis"?
2) Where and what is "the "Psak of Maran Harav Steinman shlita"??? Is it written or verbal or what? Did/does he support Tropper and if so what did he say if he said it? This is a big chiddush?
3) Who are the "Meny Gdolim in Eretz Yiroel and America" that" are shocked by this conuct."?
4) Does anyone know anything about "A meeting of Gedolei Roshei yeshvot is scheduled for next week." (i.e. in December of 2009)? and what was decided if anything?
5) Who decided and who abides by the last point that "For the immediate the Tzibur of Bnei Torah should distance themselves from the above 3 Rabbiws."? What does this mean, that those three rabbis are in trouble?
Rav Mendlowitz is the grandson of R' Shraga Feivel Mendlowitz ztl who devoted much of his website to exposing Tropper. His brother wrote a book published by Feldheim so Tropper sought revenge by putting up a sign for all 3 bochurim left in Kol Yaakov that an unnamed "adam gadol" told him the book is "inappropriate and should not be read". How lame can he get?
ReplyDelete"I notice that they list R. Reuvain Feinstein as head of their halachic committee. Can this be true. "
ReplyDeleteAs long as Kaplan pours money into the organization you will see rabbis attaching themselves to it
what happened to the ejf $ ?
ReplyDeletethere's the answer to all your questions.
Eternal Watch...
ReplyDeletePlease direct me to Mendlowitz's website blog.What is the address or link?
Feivel Mendlowitz = Paul Manilow = Unorthodox Jew
ReplyDeletehttp://theunorthodoxjew.blogspot.com
In relation to all this it may just be that EJF has been renamed for yet another reason, perhaps it may have something to do with the legal struggles between Tom Kaplan/Leib Tropper versus Guma Aguiar/Ellen Kaplan Aguiar (Tom's sister) over the profits from their joint business at Leor Energy and control of the Lillian Jean Kaplan Foundation that had been the source of funding for EJF, that also carried the "Lillian Jean Kaplan" name as part of its title, that is, that it may be possible that Tom Kaplan/Tropper had to come up with a new name for EJF because it just may be that Guma and his savvy mother Ellen may have succeeded in getting a huge share of Leor Energy profits and wresting the legal control of both the Lillian Jean Kaplan Foundation, and its NAME, which was founded by them (i.e. Guma and his mother signed the incorporation papers) and hence it would be impossible for EJF to go on because the EJF name was also known as the "Lillian Jean Kaplan" something or other for the Jewish family.
ReplyDeleteThus Tom Kaplan/Tropper HAD to drop the EJF name legally and come up with a new name for an organization with goals IDENTICAL to EJF's but being forced to drop the "Lillian Jean Kaplan" name ANYWHERE.
There seems to have been a news blackout, but surely there are legal records of the cases and its resolution (if they have been resolved) -- also WHAT ABOUT THE CASE OF TROPPER SUING GUMA? anyone who can help out here please?
How about Jersey Girl, can she do some research to clarify what happened in the end with the case over the fight over splitting the pot over Leor Energy, Tropper's case against Guma Aguiar for allegedly assaulting him, and the related case of the fate of the Lillian Jean Kaplan Foundation.
Time will tell.
People, I am sorry, this is getting too much into the realm of myth and, frankly spoken, lashon hara.
ReplyDeleteI am not a supporter of Tropper by any means but some things are just not correct. He always davens with a minyan at his home! I have seen it with my own eyes. He is despite everything that may have happened a very learned and generous man. Many gerim the EJF has accompanied during their journeys recieved scholarships if they could not afford paying for the program. What I have witnessed is that he behaved totally correct and very welcoming towards the EJF-gerim, some of them who stayed at his home over Shabbosim between 2005 and 2008. Among them were younger women as well. He did never, ever make any move towards them. Was supportive, looked for Shidduchim for them or did do marriage counseling if they were married. What may have happened years later in 2009 is beyond my experience.
I do not want to protect Tropper in any way and I am not affiliated with EJF, Horizons or Kol Yaakov. The scandal may be true or may not be true or partially true. We will never find out.
However it is a shame that obviously there is a power struggle going on between the Hareidi and the MO worlds. Hareidi through the vehicle of EJF did fire on the modern RCA conversions first, not taking them serious and even speaking up against some of them. Now, in turn the modern orthodox world is taking revenge.
This is horrible and puts the status of many gerim and their children in question just because some rabbis just cannot accept the other branch of orthodox (!!!!) judaism. They really hurt the WEAKEST parts of Jewish society, the gerim, through such actions! A ger does constantly struggle to prove his or her Yiddishkeit, is being constantly observed and criticized and does not have a family to support him or her. It is for a ger already hard enough to find a shidduch but by questioning conversions done by the other branch of orthodoxy those rabbis really mess things up and only the very brave would date and marry a ger.
This is a chillul Hashem, against Torah and a big, big, big aveirah! You are not allowed to hurt your fellow Jew (Torah says the ger is in weakness and helplessness comparable to an orphan or a widow, he needs special love, care and sensitivity) in such a way and put many Jewish families in a limbo concerning their status.
The conversions performed by the (independent!!!) batei dinim used by the EJF btw. are of course good and accepted in Israel (forget the lists only listing the RCA, the Rabbanut considers conversions on an individual case basis and all of the batei dinim used by the EJF are accepted and there have been several EJF gerim in the past who completed aliyah!).
So are the modern orthodox conversions.
All that fighting really is a big aveirah hurting the weakest parts of Jewish society.
I hope it will stop! Us observant Jews have to cooperate instead of fighting each other. In the future we will have to deal with other issues such as children and grandchildren of Reform "gerim" or the so-called "paternal Jews" the Reform movement creates. We have to stay strong and stick together to be able to face those challenges threatening Am Yisroel.
Actually, it was the Chareidi world in Eretz Yisroel that opposed the EJF since the EJF was proseltyzing gentile spouses of Jews to convert them. That is something at odds with Jewish law or practice.
DeleteAnd the fact is that many MO conversions are in fact invalid. That fact cannot be papered over and ignored as those people remain gentiles.
Actually the EJF did not solely assist gentiles being married to a Jew, they as well helped single prospective gerim to find recognized, halachically clean, hareidi-affiliated batei din (some of which consisted of dayanim from different branches of right wing orthodox movements such as litvishe together with chasidim to ENSURE that the conversion will be accepted by all branches of orthodoxy).
DeleteSure, the conversion of non jewish spouses is and has always been an issue and a problem as marriage to a Jew doesnt qualify as a valid reson for conversion. However I think it is better to convert the spouse and kids of a Jew (if and ONLY IF the family is willing to live frum) than letting another jewish family go down the drain.
There are multiple very positive examples that this has been the right way. And the non-jewish spouses willing to convert did not have it easy in any case - one lady I know studied 3 years (more than your average MO ger would) to become Jewish. The family (including the kids) is fully Jewish now and, while modern orthodox in lifestyle, torah observant. Kids attend frum schools.
Well, MO is another problem. I agree on that. Many so called modern orthodox places that do conversions are in fact conservadox or conservative (halachically questionable, especially concerning the observance of all their "dayanim") and many MO gerim are very lax on standards after their giyur. By no means all of them but a great number.