Tuesday, July 27, 2021

Are Chassidic Rebbes Avoda Zarah?

 





















20 comments :

  1. Aryeh Eidensohn?


    Son?

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  2. So if I make the same claim, I'm warped, even if based on Rambam. When a member of your family copies my claim and publishes, then it's a valid halachic teshuva.

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  3. Well you could ask the question a different way - is Chassidus a form of Chrisianity?

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  4. Aryeh's article, in its entirety, can be found by downloading the Torah Journal, here:
    https://forum.otzar.org/download/file.php?id=100848

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  5. Nope!
    You make no pretense to justify your claims in a scholarly manner.
    there are just things you don't like

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  6. Do you paint all types of Chassidus with the same brush, or are there exceptions?

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  7. If I understand the system correctly, the Chasid believes that the Tzaddik (usually his Rebbe) stands between him and God and he needs to "betn" the Tzaddik to help his prayers reach the top floor. How different is this from the Catholic system where the Pope is God's personal representative and all prayers go through JC?

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  8. Au contraire, I bring sources which you reject because not everyone agreed with Maimonides .

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  9. Are you saying that ALL Chassidim believe this?
    Christians believe that Jesus = god.
    Do all/some Chassidim believe this about their Rebbe?

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  10. when i do bring proofs, you are not satisfied, you claim i am either misrepresenting the Rambam, or that he is irrelevant

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  11. depends, do all chassidim accept the Tanya for example?

    Most that I have come acros swear by it, regardless of which sect they belong to.
    BTW, remember, for satmar, they have chas v'chalila 2 authors of history, One being Hakadosh Baruch Hu, and chas v'shalom a 2nd "actor" named Sam@el who manages some of the historical events that they are not too pleased about. Dualism.
    Another example is the innovation of L'shem Yichud Kudsheh brich Hu and shechinateh - which is anothe form of dualism, not limited to hassidim, but was vehemently opposed by the Gaon and leader of the generation - Rav Yechezkel Landau - the Noda B'Yehuda. What is the point of going into dualism if your religion is a monotheistic one?
    It's not enough that the Xtians have a trinity, that we have to compete with them?

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  12. I don't get your point. It's part of the system of Chasidus. It's how their beliefs work and what made them different from the Misnagdim. This was something that made the
    Gr'a vigorously oppose the movement.

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  13. The reason you don't get my point, is because your knowledge about Chassidim and Chassidus is apparently quite limited.

    By painting all Chassidim with the same brush, you've demonstrated that you're not sophisticated enough to differentiate between the different beliefs of the various strands of Chassidim.

    Moreover, your presentation of the reason for the Gra's opposition to the movement; is quite simplistic, and uninformed; and is also possibly historically incorrect.

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  14. Your proofs are primarily your personal beliefs or things taken out of context or minority views

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  15. same "minority" as used in this kuntres
    Maimonidean monotheism is - as we have dsicussed - countered by the pan(en)theistic Kabbalah.


    How does a minority suddenly become a majority?

    Easy, write it in scholarly Hebrew , get published in a frum magazine, and there you are!

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  16. Even amongst poskim, they are "personal views" in the sense that the posek selects sources that support their own views.

    Look at the disputes between Rav bleich shlita and Rav tendler shlita on time of death. They argue passionately about the evidence, the Halacha, and the admissibility of the other's sources.
    Same goes, eg the debate over Dayan Sherman's negation of giur.

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  17. Wow so that is how you view yourself!?

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  18. I don't view myself as a posek or gadol. Quite the contrary.
    Personal views are based on what we have learned about Torah. So my learning is a few molecules compared to Rav bleich's vast sea of knowledge.

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