Secular studies

Igros Moshe (YD III #82) Question: Are secular studies permitted? Answer  It is prohibited to nullify Torah study in order to study secular subjects. My views on this are well known in the Torah World. I have spoken many times to bnei Torah on this issue. of secular studies. I have repeatedly said that for bnei Torah and yeshiva students who are capable of growing in Totah and pure fear of G-d that secular studies even if it is does not involve heresy or mingling with women it is prohibited to desert eternal life.  This is prohibited even after reaching a high level of Torah knowledge. Involvement with secular studies will prevent most yeshiva students who have not not learned enough, it is not likely that they will ever become  a true Torah scholar. It is well known that to be a Torah scholar in this generation it requires total utilization of all of one’s G-d given abilities and not to waste them on secular studies. In addition when studying both, eventually the secular studies become the main study and Torah becomes secondary.because of the advice of the yetzer harah. This results in even more neglect of Torah study especially if he views it as required for parnossa. . It is simply impossible to become a genuine talmid chachom or ben Torah by stealing time and effort and intelligence from Torah study in order to study secular subjects. Instead of advancincing in Torah he becomes increasingly diminished.  This is especially true when he views that those who go to college are more successful than those who don’t. As a consequence he will go to public school where there are are all the abominations of the world even though his yetzer harah will say this will be just for a short time so he won’t be harmed. It is not likely that he will end up even as a ben Torah and surely not a genuine Torah scholar. He needs to be aware that there has been a great destruction of Torah in the world and that he and every other yeshiva student therefore has a great obligation to strive to greatness in Torah, halacha and fear of G-d. He needs to view this as an obligation for the entire Jewish people.  The bottom line it is obvious even though there are those who don’t say it out loud to the public or even to the religious community that it is prohibited for yeshiva students  who are capable of growing in Torah to steal time and effort and thought from Torah study in order to study secular subjects. As regards parnossa, I have said many times that this is the advice of the wicked. One should not desert Torah study at all even for a short period. 

Igros Moshe (YD IV #36.16) Question You ask about how to deal with those who are not capable of growing in Torah either because they lack the intelligence or because of laziness? Answer. Obviously it is not relevant to require them to learn as I wrote that the bnei Torah is required. It would be appropriate to teach them a skill that is most appropriate to their nature. Even if this largely interferes with their Torah learning to prepare them for this work. The Yavetz lists in his siddur those things that a person who can not learn a lot of Torah must be taught. If he is fit for learning engineering or medicine it is appropriate that he learn it as long as he can learn without being taught heresy and in classes without girls. It is best if the program is under rabbinical supervision.

Rav Yisroel Belsky told me that his success in dealing with kashrus processes - and his ability to deal with these issues better than other rabbis - was due to the fact that he took his secular studies seriously.  It is obviously that if one wants to deal with metzius issues that one needs to have the basic background in physics, biology, and chemistry. A basic understanding of the scientific method of validation. Being able to read precisely and to be able to communicate accurately in writing as well as speech.

From Making of a Gadol () My father related that he was told by someone whose oldest son had just reached school age that he had decided not to send the child to a school with secular studies so that the boy would be able to devote all his time to learning Torah. My father protested, "But your son will be unable to read even the street signs to know where he is standing." When the unbending father replied, "R' Hayyim Soloveichik also did not read Russian," our protagonist, who felt that the child's development would be impeded altogether by the abnormal education his father was charting for him, argued, "Yes, but R' Hayyim had a shamosh who knew Russian and read the signs while escorting him through the streets. Do you expect your son to have a shamosh when he grows up?"

 It is noteworthy that when asked as an octogenarian whether young students at a Monsey yeshiva may be permitted to read light English literature (which would pass faculty censorship), my father- with the caveat that he would be "considered a leftist" for the ruling - referred to this experience of his own to prove that such reading is not harmful. He mentioned that he read Russian translations of such classics as the science fantasies of Jules Verne and the Sherlock Holmes stories of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle :. He added that the licentiousness of present-day society and literature mandates that contemporary secular books be carefully screened before being put onto a permitted-reading list. The principal of the secular department in Mesivta Torah Vodaath, R' Moshe Lonner, reported d that my father suggested students study certain plays by Shakespeare "because in olden times there was less reference to topics to which yeshiva bahurim should not be exposed", and referred to his own reading of these classics in the Russian language. (He added at the time that we should not think that people of the Elizabethan and Victorian ages were better than those of latter times - "there was simply more , shame then".)

Also like my father, R' Aaron Kotler dabbled in secular studies at this time. He was more interested in literature than in the sciences which attracted my father's interest. My father stated to his son-in-law R' Yisrael Shurin that R' Aaron was proficient in all of classical Russian literature'L This was corroborated when, during a visit with a young, intellectual protoge of the Hazon-Ish who headed a yeshiva in Ramlah, R' Aaron blurted out, "This was expounded by Aleksander Pushkin" - as reported to this author by the yeshiva head '. The Ramlah Yeshiva was visited by R' Aaron Kotler, R' Shmuel Graineman and the Kopycznitzer Rebbe, R' Avrohm-Yehoshua' Heschel, in the summer of 5714 (1954). At the same time, Moshe Bar-Sela', director of the Labor and Social Affairs Ministry and a Pushkin buff, dropped by for a glass of tea and a chat - people were wont to stop off in Ramlah on the then long drive from Jerusalem to Tel Aviv. When Bar-Sela' quoted a line from the poem Yevgeni On'yegin without naming the author, R' Aaron reacted as reported. (Pushkin was a Russian author favored in Jewish intellectual circles. This author came across an interview of French Jewish philosopher Emmanuel Levinas by Francois Poiri in "Emmanuel Levinas, Qui etes-vous?? ''° which has the thinker relating, "A few years ago an Israeli born in Eastern Europe paid me a visit. Upon entering my home, he noticed that I had the complete works of Pushkin on the bookshelves. 'You can see right away,' he said, 'that this is a Jewish home.'"

Netziv(Devarim 32:2): ... an elevated person is nurtured through the study of talmud which is compared to rain. And by means of his understanding of Bible which comes through the study of agada which is compared to dew. He then can come to proper ethical sensibilities and knowledge of how to conduct himself in society and to elevate himself by means of knowledge of secular wisdom which is compared to the sun. This is expressed in Koheles where is says, “What is the benefit for a person who labors under the sun?” This indicates that knowledge of natural science and society brings honor to a person in the eyes of the nations of the world and thus serves to elevate the stature of Jews. However the critical issue is the order of the education. First comes rain (talmudic studies) and afterwards knowledge of agada which is compared to dew. It is only afterwards that it is appropriate to enhance ones abilities through secular knowledge which is comparable to the sun. However prior to talmudic studies, secular studies do not serve to elevate the honor of Jews at all. This is also true even if the secular studies are preceded by the in depth study of the Bible which is compared to dew. That is because without mastering talmudic studies the secular studies will serve to pervert and distort the understanding of the Bible.

Ramchal(Derech Chochma p116): A person who needs to mingle with the non‑Jewish scholars should learn that which causes them to respect him. Consequently G‑d will be sanctified through him.

Rashbatz (Magen Avos 2:19): Know how to reply to the heretic. This is the justification of our practice to learn secular knowledge in order that we can reply to them and tell them that they have no proofs that contradict the Torah and Prophets. This is not a violation of the prohibition of learning books not included in the Bible - that applies only to books like Ben Sira which are part of the ancient Wisdom Literature or books written by heretics which lack wisdom and are just a waste of time. Furthermore, the prohibition of learning Greek Wisdom… does not apply to wisdom which is learned through intellectual analysis but refers to a skill that existed in Talmudic times for communicating by hints and allusions… In fact, this skill is not inherently prohibited but was prohibited because of its role in a particular event in the Destruction of the Temple…. The apparently prohibition to keep your children away for higayon - but higayon is not logic or rhetoric. Rashi says it refers to idle chatter… In sum, those books which are based upon intellectual analysis are not prohibited and someone who reads them should accept that which is true and will learn to reply to their claims which are against the Torah. We find this with R’ Meir whose teacher was a heretic and would accept the truth and discard the falsehoods… Furthermore Chagiga (11b) states that one can investigate anything concerning this world but not which above or below it and not which is before and after it. Therefore, it is permitted to investigate scientifically anything connected with this world. We are only prohibited to read those books which don’t contain knowledge concerning reality.