Saturday, June 9, 2012

Tamar's supporters rally primarily to defeat "evil"

guest post: Some have asserted that the attacks and demonstrations against Aharon and his family are contrary to halacha and are counterproductive if the goal is for Tamar to receive a get. They have wondered whether those attacking and demonstrating against Aharon and his family are even doing so primarily in order to help Tamar receive a get. Here is the answer from the demonstrators themselves.

The author of this blog has previously noted that she is related to Tamar (a sister of Tamar's brother-in-law Dovy Goldschmidt, and daughter of Moscow Chief Rabbi Pinchas Goldschmidt), and appears to be Estee Goldschmidt, the organizer of the online petition against Aharon.

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Okay. So another three months have passed. Tamar still has no get. This Sunday rallies will be held at the locations of Aharon's mother and uncle, his biggest supporters.

*The reason it is extremely important for you to go to the rally, is not because of the impact it might have on Tamar, but primarily because of the impact it will have on you.*

It is similar to the marches for Soviet Jewry in the eighties. Two hundred and fifty thousand Jews gathered in Washington to rally on behalf of Jewish brethren in Russia screaming: "Mr. Gorbachev, let our people go!" No matter what it accomplished in terms of affecting Soviet Jews, it accomplished so much more in the impact it had on those American Jews who stood up against injustice, and became part of a larger picture fighting for good to triumph over evil.

I was once on a date where the guy brought up the agunah issue and then said: "All those people who fight for agunahs, do they really care about them? Of course not. They are just pushing feminist agenda." 

I just looked at him. There was no point in arguing.

After a hundred and twenty years, you won't be held accountable for not changing the world. You will be held accountable for not trying. This Sunday presents you with a tremendous opportunity to stand up against evil, to stand for "Tzedek Tzedek Tirdof" (Justice, Justice, you shall pursue). Having attended rallies in the past, I must say, they are some of the most bonding, intensely emotional and inspiring experiences I have ever lived through.
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7 comments:

  1. avfJune 10, 2012 at 5:24 AM

    It seems she is trying to encourage more people to attend the rally and get involved. Kol Hakovad.

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  2. emesJune 11, 2012 at 12:51 AM

    I am sure her father is real proud of her. She never even met Aharon or his family but wrote pure lies on her blog about him and his family. What a chilul hashem! If this what her father has taught her then then the people of Russia should look for a new rabbi.

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  3. Shades of GreyJune 13, 2012 at 9:59 PM

    Thanks for the link and the increase in blog traffic. I don't know how to thank you for digging up an old post from February 4 months later and bringing it to the attention of Jewish blog readers.

    In addition, I'm sure Tamar appreciates the increased publicity for her plight. Hopefully it will be resolved soon, and Aharon will deliver the get she deserves so that she can move on with her life.

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    Replies
    1. Daas TorahJune 13, 2012 at 10:43 PM

      you are welcome. Glad there is some positive development in the case. I am sure Tamar appreciates the publicity but not the bad light that these posts put her in. Calling her an aguna is rather unfortunate for the real agunas out there. Tamar's arrogance as well as that of her rabbinic advisor's and friends has turned what would have been a 1 year separation and Get into a four year war of attrition that nobody is winning.

      I would suggest you spend some time reading the various posts and comments by people on both sides of the issue that have been published on this blog. This is a serious matter halachic and psychological matter - and the cheap soundbytes issued by Tamar's camp - might look good on the Huffington Post - but they are not convincing Aharon and his supporters.

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    2. Shades of GreyJune 14, 2012 at 5:14 AM

      It is quite appropriate to call her a "modern-day aguna" which makes the current sad state of affairs fit into the realm of established halacha. Thankfully, this did unfortunate turn of events did not exist in our national history, and thus we have to create a term by which to refer it.

      "Real agunas" are those, for example, whose husbands disappeared after the tragic events of September 11th. Those are classic cases of what we halachically call an aguna. The women we find nowadays with recalcitrant husbands who refuse to give their gittin have perforce created the necessity of figuring out how to approach this type of confrontation in halacha. I hope this point of clarification makes sense.

      I have indeed spent some time reading various posts and comments on your blog and others, and without making a judgement call against either Aharon or Tamar, I find it absurd that any man would manipulate halacha for the purpose of personal satisfaction. Whatever happens with their child is dependent upon the law of the United States. His utilization of her get, which is certainly within her rights at this point in time, especially given that she has received a civil divorce, is nothing but a shanda.

      What "convincing" does there need to be for a man or his advisers/supporters/whoever for him to give a get when a marriage has totally dissolved, is no longer reparable, and thus fits the definition of a union that should be formally concluded by the giving of that get?

      No man, or legitimate halachic authority that I am aware of (past or present) sanctions the use of a get as a bargaining tool by which to hold a woman halachically hostage. If he wants to deal with extra-marital issues like visitation, payments, etc - deal with that in the court system, but don't hold her back from moving forward with her life.

      All this behavior does is make the non/less religious and more liberal of our brethren (and gentiles as well) shake their heads at us in derision for laws that look misogynistic.

      Just to be clear, I DO NOT believe the Torah or halacha is misogynistic in any way whatsoever, but I can certainly see how it can appear that way when someone foolishly perverts the halachic system in a fashion such as this. The only product of such behavior is a public chillul Hashem.

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    3. EmesJune 14, 2012 at 9:12 PM

      I love the way you use the term "plight." Unfortunately in this case there is no plight for her. Whatever mess she is in, is her own doing and the people who are advising her such as ora do not have her best intrests in mind.

      The perversion of Halacha and ethics on so many levels
      1) her violation of a signed agreement not to change the childs location
      2) her walking out of the baltimore beis din.
      2)Harrasment by ora and her family of the washington beis din.
      3)The bogus seruv issued by the hebrew national beis din. Which was issued immediately after the first warning
      4)The involvement of a prominent rabbi who has received support from tamars family for over 30 years in the defamation of aharon.
      5) Another Rabbi who didnt even bother to check the facts but signed off and encouraged the harrasment based on what the other rabbi who had received significant support from the epsteins for over 30 years
      6) Oras harrasment of aharon and aharons family who live over 200 miles away. With rallies, hate mail, and threats. In addition to the motzei shem ra and media circus they are running. A chillul hashem of such magnitude!
      7) Harrasing public official such as the good congressman who is a tremendous friend to the JEws.
      8) she has fought and continues to fight to have him lose custody at one point she strictly enforced a 6PM visitation right on friday? How did she expect for him pick up their daughter when shabbos began at 4:15 PM?

      Then you wonder why she hasn't received a get? Halachically she is considered a moredes therefore she is not entitled to one. Her actions show very badly for her! Abducting their child and using it as a tool against her ex is despicable. Shame on her and her family for making a mockery of the plights of the true agunos out there!

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  4. stanJune 14, 2012 at 6:10 PM

    1. "The women we find nowadays with recalcitrant husbands who refuse to give their gittin have perforce created the necessity of figuring out how to approach this type of confrontation in halacha."

    The one who is recalcitrant is Tamar who abducted Aharon's child and has used the corrupt goyshe court system to prevent him proper access to his child.

    2."I find it absurd that any man would manipulate halacha for the purpose of personal satisfaction."
    a)by refusing to listen to the baltimore bais din, tamar was the one manipulating halocho.
    b)by going to a corrupt bais din of belsky, wohlmark (discredited by rav elyashiv) and ralbag (no one trusts him e.g. his fake hechsher) who is manipulating halocho?
    c. by going to a bais din so far away from washington which has no jurisdiction over a washinton DC case who is manipulating halocho?

    3."Whatever happens with their child is dependent upon the law of the United States." she can get a get from the courts as well. what an absurdity, ignore halocho except when it comes to the get.

    4"His utilization of her get, which is certainly within her rights at this point in time, especially given that she has received a civil divorce, is nothing but a shanda."
    a)A GET is not a RIGHT -it is something that Bais Din needs to pasken on and the Baltimore Bais Din never made a psak that Friedman has to give a Get.
    b)"especially given that she has received a civil divorce" - this has less than zero bearing in halocho.

    5."No man, or legitimate halachic authority that I am aware of (past or present) sanctions the use of a get as a bargaining tool by which to hold a woman halachically hostage. If he wants to deal with extra-marital issues like visitation, payments, etc - deal with that in the court system, but don't hold her back from moving forward with her life."
    a)If there is no halachik requirement to give a get, it does not need to be given.
    b) Its fine for women to litigate in arko'oys and make a chilul Hashem and demand money they are not entitled to, its fine to use arko'oys to sop the children have a relationship with their father but the husband is the one using bargaining tools. Absurd.

    6. the public chilul Hashem we need to be concerned abut is the use of arko'oys.

    Shades of Grey you do not know what you are speaking/ writing about.

    ReplyDelete

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