tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post7595026027125915078..comments2024-03-29T12:21:24.976+03:00Comments on Daas Torah - Issues of Jewish Identity: Lonna Kin Divorce: Unwilling to Allow His Wife a Divorce, He Marries AnotherDaas Torahhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07252904288544083215noreply@blogger.comBlogger159125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-57986891811537999892017-05-15T00:26:00.544+03:002017-05-15T00:26:00.544+03:00hundreds of men, more than womenhundreds of men, more than womenspeakup4freedomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-76431770550170341522014-04-04T05:08:15.017+03:002014-04-04T05:08:15.017+03:00This brings to mind the Catholic rule about gettin...This brings to mind the Catholic rule about getting an annulment of the marriage. Depending on your religion, you could be legally divorced but morally and spiritually married. It certainly becomes a sticky wicket, so to speak.Janet Rogathttp://www.hannanblacklaw.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-44099253109080926512014-04-01T18:13:43.747+03:002014-04-01T18:13:43.747+03:00Is it any wonder after seeing this firsthand in La...Is it any wonder after seeing this firsthand in Las Vegas that Israel Meir Kin has acted as he has? ( http://cleanupyoungisrael.blogspot.com ) .<br /><br />Young Israel Aish of Las Vegas and its National Council flouted the Torah when they afflicted a widow in defiance of the warnings in Parshas Mishpatim AND simultaneously violated Siman 153, seif 16 the Shulchan Aruch that rules that even in a Beit Knesset belonging to a private individual, the owner cannot decide to exclude one particular person. This is mentioned in Orchot Chaim as also one of the decrees of Rabbeinu Gershom!!! Why is this not as or more important than Kin vs. Kin? Why does no one fulfill the words of Navi Yeshayahu we read every year on Shabbos Chazon to "revu almanah" ?<br />LashonTovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18036714389715221515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-59192402149054373252014-04-01T04:02:25.924+03:002014-04-01T04:02:25.924+03:00http://5tjt.com/the-heter-meah-rabbonim-an-overvie...http://5tjt.com/the-heter-meah-rabbonim-an-overview/ Herenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-24750696582179477052014-03-27T21:59:29.276+02:002014-03-27T21:59:29.276+02:00mr.yech oh i mean mr.yeshaya deal with the issues....mr.yech oh i mean mr.yeshaya deal with the issues.but u can't, so you try to squelch your opponents.binnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-56799177287816886352014-03-27T21:33:25.910+02:002014-03-27T21:33:25.910+02:00Sock-puppetry is obviously rampant on this thread....Sock-puppetry is obviously rampant on this thread. There seems to be one or two pro-Kinn posters posting under a number of similar generic or meaningless names. That is contrary to established internet norms. R' Eidensohn, if you have the ability to crack down on this, please do.yeshayanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-14931685494564194932014-03-27T20:59:14.285+02:002014-03-27T20:59:14.285+02:00Perspective: I don't know what afs saw, but am...Perspective: I don't know what afs saw, but am looking at S"A and wondering what you are talking about?Chezkas Kashrusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-66648424387102997352014-03-27T20:58:07.711+02:002014-03-27T20:58:07.711+02:00RMT -- Above you wrote that the rabbanut doesn'...RMT -- Above you wrote that the rabbanut doesn't accept R. Gestetner but only does not know of R. Abraham. The last post seems to characterize them together. Which one is it?<br /><br />Also, some posters asked you some good questions above your last post. Chezkas Kashrusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-11656905654684440502014-03-27T20:56:11.322+02:002014-03-27T20:56:11.322+02:00The arkoyos custody decision was in a case she was...The arkoyos custody decision was in a case she was plaintiff in.Natnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-35505663276060484702014-03-27T20:55:43.697+02:002014-03-27T20:55:43.697+02:00His wife took him to arkoyos and got arkoyos to re...His wife took him to arkoyos and got arkoyos to render a custody verdict in the case she opened rather than allow beis din to decide custody as he wanted and as how halacha demands.Natnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-51622926509415315902014-03-27T19:51:59.482+02:002014-03-27T19:51:59.482+02:00A.F.S.March 27, 2014 at 11:29 AM
No, a HMR is not ...<i>A.F.S.March 27, 2014 at 11:29 AM<br />No, a HMR is not available simply because a wife rejects a Get. She is entitled to reject a Get, and he must accept that. He cannot get a HMR on that basis alone.</i><br /><br />Have you ever actually read the Sh"A and what it says on these matters?Perspectivenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-46533436854646294072014-03-27T19:46:35.861+02:002014-03-27T19:46:35.861+02:00Not according to the letters written by Rabbinut. ...Not according to the letters written by Rabbinut. Here is my translation of Rav Amar's letter:<br /><br /><i>I have received your letter concerning the Rabbis Gestetner and Abraham from the 26th of Nisan 5768.<br /><br />It is my desire to inform you that Rav Abraham Gestetner of B"D Shaar Mishpat and Rav Herh Ber(Tzvi Dov) Abraham of the B"D Kahal Kedushat Levi and the Berditchiv Yeshiva are not recognized by the Chief Rabbinate of Israel. Any Gittin which are arranged by them will not be recognized here in Israel.</i><br /><br />It does not appear from this that they both sit on the same B"D but rather that they have separate Batei Din.Rabbi Michael Tzadokhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02307256653501750003noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-13605713721701240252014-03-27T18:49:51.484+02:002014-03-27T18:49:51.484+02:00RMT -
You wrote above that Rav Gestetner and Rav ...RMT -<br /><br />You wrote above that Rav Gestetner and Rav Abraham are two seperate beit dins and the issue is only with Rav Gestetners. I thought that the two them serve on beit din cases together (with a third dayan.)Chezkas Kashrusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-24528027259822494422014-03-27T18:09:33.469+02:002014-03-27T18:09:33.469+02:00And what of your hypocrisy that allows him to take...And what of your hypocrisy that allows him to take his wife to arkoyos and then when it goes against him claim that she damaged him?<br /><br />The wife dropped her case. The husband has since been the only plaintiff. It was his running to arkoyos that lost him his children and that cost him(and her btw) so much in legal fees. That is his tough luck.<br /><br />The fact that he can go to arkoyos kneged hadin and then have people who claim to be Torah Observant yiddin support him is an actual Chilul HaShem.Perspective.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-58279874623515117152014-03-27T17:57:15.002+02:002014-03-27T17:57:15.002+02:00There are about the same number of women who refus...There are about the same number of women who refuse a Get as men who refuse to give one.<br /><br />In any event and regardless of which one has more or less numerically, why isn't ORA fighting on behalf of these men - however many or few - the same way they are fighting on behalf of the women?Visitornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-35519441280939499392014-03-27T17:40:25.750+02:002014-03-27T17:40:25.750+02:00Or if documented proof from the Eida HaChareidus i...Or if documented proof from the Eida HaChareidus is produced it would also be strong proof.Visitornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-25608548247818918512014-03-27T17:39:48.689+02:002014-03-27T17:39:48.689+02:00I saw on a previous thread on this blog an anonymo...I saw on a previous thread on this blog an anonymous unsourced comment claiming that the CRC (Central Rabbinic Congress/Hisachdus HaRabbonim) in Williamsburg, Brooklyn wrote a letter saying it does not accept the R. Gestetner Beis Din as being valid. I didn't accept this claim since no photograph of any such purported letter was produced. But if a verifiable documented proof was made that the CRC/Hisachdus utterly rejects all decisions from R. Gestetner's Beis Din, that would be a much stronger proof against R. Gestetner's Beis Din than anything any part of the Israeli Rabbanut said.Visitornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-6961247346580468952014-03-27T17:33:23.562+02:002014-03-27T17:33:23.562+02:00It is doubtful (and certainly cannot be assumed) t...It is doubtful (and certainly cannot be assumed) that anything Eliyahu Ben Dahan wrote was speaking on behalf of or approved by the Chief Rabbi himself. <br /><br />It is also doubtful that every time such an issue arose (accepting a particular beit din from chutz l'aaretz or every divorce case from chutz l'aaretz) that the Chief Rabbi involved himself in every case.<br /><br />So unless the Chief Rabbi himself signed something it is presumptuous to assume he agreed with it.<br /><br />Furthermore, and this too is vital, even if Rav Shlomo Amar did take a specific position on an issue (which in this case even this much cannot be assumed), it in no way indicates that position is agreed to by the wider Chareidi rabbinic world -- such as by the Agudah, Moetzes, Chasidish Admorim, Eidah Chareidus, etc. Rav Shlomo Amar speaks for Rav Shlomo Amar; he does not speak for "the Chareidi world".Visitornoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-63979591401630858822014-03-27T16:54:07.505+02:002014-03-27T16:54:07.505+02:00So start an organization for men whose wives wont ...So start an organization for men whose wives wont accept a Get for years and cant get a HMR. I will support the organization and all three people in that category.Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-70023477527001203282014-03-27T16:52:39.891+02:002014-03-27T16:52:39.891+02:00So telling the world that he refuses to give a Get...So telling the world that he refuses to give a Get (which you dont think is wrong) is pressure? How is it pressure?<br /><br />I dont think that every Joe Shmo has the power to invalidate gittin.Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-65822296771079056142014-03-27T16:26:22.617+02:002014-03-27T16:26:22.617+02:00@halocho - You've made a great summary of the ...@halocho - You've made a great summary of the issues, and you've drilled down past the very heavy media fog of MO feminist hypocrisy. <br /><br />As far as I can tell, Emes Ve-Emunah has not posted your very enlightening comments. You are quite correct, the MO/ORA/YU feminists are incredibly hypocritical. They must suppress the truth and resort to vicious personal attacks on divorcing men because they really have no response to valid halachic and logical arguments against their misandrist feminist ideology. <br /><br />For example, see "frum" attorney Daniel Schwartz's vicious, hypocritical personal attacks against Meir Kin on the Emes Ve-Emunah blog. There's not an iota of valid halachic arguments in his comments. <br /><br />For a so-called "frum" attorney to accept payments from a Jewish woman using archaos against her husband, while attempting to claim that "as far as Judaism is concerned it's his (the husband's) fault" is mindboggling hypocrisy and absurdity.EmesLeYaacovnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-67534661730527107852014-03-27T15:44:19.879+02:002014-03-27T15:44:19.879+02:00RMT: Eliyahu Ben-Dahan is not Chareidi and his wri...RMT: Eliyahu Ben-Dahan is not Chareidi and his writing a letter does not represent the Chareidi view. A.F.S.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-27129867230346256442014-03-27T14:32:57.913+02:002014-03-27T14:32:57.913+02:00The rabbanut was not run by Chareidim when that le...<i>The rabbanut was not run by Chareidim when that letter was issued.</i><br />Re: The Gestetner letter, the Rabbinut was run by Rav Shlomo Amar(who is Chareidi) who operated in close concert with Rav Ovadia Yosef(Chareidi). <br /><br />Yes Eliyahu Ben-Dahan signed the letter. However, Rav Mordechai Eliyahu released two sefarim of Teshuvot that he claimed to have issued while sitting as the chief Rabbi, and easily half of them bear the signature of Eliyahu Ben-Dahan. <br /><br />My understanding is that he transcribed the verbal response of the Chief Rabbi as his secretary. When the Chief Rabbi was too busy to write the response himself. However, the opinion is fully that of the Chief Rabbi(Rav Amar in this case). <br />Rabbi Michael Tzadokhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02307256653501750003noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-36965587704720698992014-03-27T13:44:17.985+02:002014-03-27T13:44:17.985+02:00Lets see if Harry Myrles will let the following po...Lets see if Harry Myrles will let the following post through:<br /><br />halocho • 2 minutes ago<br />Hold on, this is waiting to be approved by Emes Ve-Emunah.<br />This whole complaint against Mr. Kin is a result of people blatantly ignoring halocho. The halocho is clear cut that someone who goes to arko"oys loses all rights in Bais Din. This is so clear cut that someone who doesn't even go to court but "merely" refuses to appear in bais din when summonsed loses all rights regarding ever summonsing anyone else to bais din (lo tizias dina) - see the veretsky school building issue.<br /><br />Ms kin was lo tzias dina. According to Mr Kin, he summonsed Lonna to 4 different botei din but she refused to appear. She gets custody through arko"oys and equitable distribution and child support and then demands a Get. Now in order to recoup his losses and his son he goes to a bais din that tells Lonna to get out of arko"oys and follow halocho and all you people on this blog have a problem with that.<br /><br />Going to arko"oys, destroying your ex financially and then saying everying is over and I want my get well that's not how halocho works regardless of what anyone tells you. And this is not my opinion but the opinion of Rav Pam, the saintly Rosh yeshiva of Torah V'daas, rav Shmuel Birnbaum and many other chareidi Rabbis.<br /><br />See the following kol koreh posted below. We live in an upside down world. Why is it that none of the women who go to arko"oys regarding divorce matters are ever put in cheirem and ostracized?<br /><br />And why do they go to arko"oys ? Because secular law favors the custodial parent and who is the custodial parent in 95% the woman. They get a far better deal in arko"oys than in secular court.<br /><br />We can adopt secular morality all we like but it is not Torah morality. As long as Lonna is benefiting from the judgement of secular court she is in arko"oys according to every posek. And yes she is chayav to repay her ex's legal fees. That is not extortion.<br /><br />here is the link to the kol koreh. I hope you are objective enough to allow this post through. And please don't start woth novol birhsus hatorah. The halocho deems someone who goes to arko"oys a rosho and a mechalel sheym shomayim. rav ovadia has said that such a person loses their cheilek in oylom habo. Women who run to arko"oys are not agunahs at all. If the problem of arko"oys would be eliiminated and they would go to bais din instead the agunah problem would largely disappear.<br /><br />I find the attitude of YU/ ORA to be incredibly hypocritical. They have never ever condemned a woman for being in arko"oys. The torah considers this almost as a cardinal sin. Divorce court also involves mesirah for which the punishment is to be placed in gehonom for eternity and your soul destroyed. And lets not start with democracy and it not being mesirah. Anyone spending a day in divorce court will know it has nothing to do with justice and fairness at all.<br /><br />You might not agree and in fact disagree very vociferously but stop presenting this Get issue in such a simplistic way. A get needs to be given when the woman follows the halocho. If she breaks it there is no moral argument in the world strong enough to overcome her halachic requirements first. if she fails to fulfill her halachik requirements that is her problem.<br /><br />http://mishpattsedek.com/mtwp/...<br /><br />If you are really interested in the truth you will allow this to be posted.<br />halochonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-56420058714174687572014-03-27T11:31:22.953+02:002014-03-27T11:31:22.953+02:00The Eida and Rav Shternbuch never said they wouldn...The Eida and Rav Shternbuch never said they wouldn't accept his gittin. There is no letter saying any such thing. Otherwise produce a letter from the Eida or Rav Shternbuch.A.F.S.noreply@blogger.com