tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post6524339881786955333..comments2024-03-29T12:21:24.976+03:00Comments on Daas Torah - Issues of Jewish Identity: Knesset member against Supreme Rabbinical Court rejection of Rav Druckmans' conversionsDaas Torahhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07252904288544083215noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-73848847719709410582008-05-16T06:44:00.000+03:002008-05-16T06:44:00.000+03:00To Jersey Girl of May 15, 2008 10:56 PM: I can't b...To Jersey Girl of May 15, 2008 10:56 PM: I can't believe it. There you go again flying off on your tangents and preaching to the converted because I am not even arguing with the points you raise.<BR/><BR/>My ONLY point with regard to Mr. Ben Sasson was that he was was an example of a VERY intelligent Israeli politician who had expressed a very intelligent opinion and there is no need for you to carry on, and on, and on, first that he is not a rabbi (which noone said he was) and then to belittle an appreciation of how to HEAR what he has to say, so that you, and rabbis who you seem to think might act like you (might is right?), not come across as cruel dictators and absolute tyrants who don't care about the people they are decreeing upon when you utter your childish nonsense that "Judaism is not a democracy, we do not have "equal rights under the law". There is a place for everyone and everyone in his place."<BR/><BR/>That makes Judaism sound like Communist or Czarist Russia or like Syria under the Assads the way you describe poor old scardy-cat Judaism. Sorry to tell you, but Judaism invented the higher and nobler notions of HOLINESS, FREEDOM, LIBERATION, HUMAN RIGHTS, THE RIGHTS OF MAN, WOMEN'S RIGHTS, THE GODLINESS OF ALL PEOPLE and many more such universalistic ideals and ideas that can be found all over in the Torah and the Pophets in the Tanach. <BR/><BR/>One can argue from all sorts of views, but try to stick to the topic at hand and not destroy Mr. Ben Sasson because he has the guts to speak out about his concerns.<BR/><BR/>What will happen when the Haredim finally take over Israel? <BR/><BR/>Will they rule it like the Ayatolas rule Iran or the Saudis rule Saudi Arabia and women will be banned from everything accept from being baby machines, cooks and laundromats for their husbands? <BR/><BR/>But I do not wish to annoy you too much just to show you that getting into all sorts of tangents in a discussion are not helpful, and certainly you should not preach to the converted (oops, ban pun here I guess!)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-87615027282507279822008-05-15T22:56:00.000+03:002008-05-15T22:56:00.000+03:00RaP:"learned layman, politicians and the like do n...RaP:<BR/><BR/>"learned layman, politicians and the like do not shape halacha in the Jewish religion". <BR/><BR/>Only Gedolim can decide halacha. <BR/><BR/>The Torah is not up for a vote. If it were, I would surely vote for ice cream after meat, 8 days of niddah and driving on Shabbat. <BR/><BR/>Judaism is not a democracy, we do not have "equal rights under the law". There is a place for everyone and everyone in his place. <BR/><BR/>A woman cannot give Birkat Kohanim or be a Rabbi according to our Torah anymore than a man can decide to give birth. <BR/><BR/>Just as a Yisrael cannot decide to be a Kohen and a woman cannot decide to be a Rabbi, it is also true that any number of "balabatim" or members of Knesset cannot vote to allow Gentiles to be considered Jewish without conversion k'halacha. <BR/><BR/>Conversion k'halacha, like all halacha is decided based upon the Psak of the Gedolim. <BR/><BR/>Who is a Gadol is also not up for popular vote, if it were then I imagine that Yaakov Shweky would be in the lead or perhaps Lev Leviev or the Lubavitcher Rebbe (being dead shouldn't interfere with being a halachic decisor, after all according to the worlds most popular religion being dead doesn't stop one from being the Messiah).<BR/><BR/>Some American Jews cannot understand the difference between Torah law and American law (why don't women "count" for a minyan, they have the right to vote??). <BR/><BR/>Despite the fact that American law is based upon the Torah, our Torah is not based upon concepts determined good and just according to Western society. <BR/><BR/>What is "good and just" according to Judaism is what is correct according to halacha.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-15025309879281264622008-05-15T04:37:00.000+03:002008-05-15T04:37:00.000+03:00Mr. Ben Sasson's argument is without flaw, and dem...Mr. Ben Sasson's argument is without flaw, and demonstrates clearly how Zionism's population growth goals can only be achieved by disposing of Halacha.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-16546938065596572792008-05-15T01:38:00.000+03:002008-05-15T01:38:00.000+03:00To Jesey Girl of May 14, 2008 11:43 PM: Again you ...To Jesey Girl of May 14, 2008 11:43 PM: <BR/><BR/>Again you miss the point. Nowhere does Ben Sasson claim to be a "rabbi or Dayan or Rosh Yeshiva" in this article or anywhere. So why throw in a Red Herring argument when his status as Jewish clergy is not under discussion.<BR/><BR/>In this context Ben Sasson is speaking as a learned LAYMAN, what we call a BALEBOS, who happens to be in a position of political power. This is like the president or the chairman of the board of a synagogue or Beth Din or yeshiva speaking and such a person must also be respected for what he says.<BR/><BR/>And by the way, in Israel, KNESSET members have a share in the vote and a huge say in who gets appointed in the official posts of the Israeli Chief rabbinate -- a job once held by no less a rabbinic personage than Rav Eliashiv shlit"a -- which is why the Charedi world rejects those rabbis as being tools of the Zionists (but that too is another discussion and a scenario which you are either ignorant of or overlook for your own convenience), since all serious and respectful views must be considered in a NATIONAL DEBATE about a matter that affects ALL Jews, not just rabbis or one group's interests, in order that if and when the time comes to make peace between all the sides EVERYONE should feel that they have been heard and that their views have been taken into full account.<BR/><BR/>So quit this nonsense of knocking people down because this Blog spends plenty of time quoting from and posting articles from newspapers and media sources written essentially anonymous journalists but those views are important and must be noted and we know full well and do not need to be remidned from the peanut gallery that they are not rabbis or rebbes or dayanim or rosh yeshivas.<BR/><BR/>Try to learn to LISTEN to all points of view of an argument and not just be selective and pick and choose what suits your own already made up mind.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-37051937964569967682008-05-14T23:55:00.000+03:002008-05-14T23:55:00.000+03:00To the best of my knowledge MK Menahem Ben-Sasson ...To the best of my knowledge MK Menahem Ben-Sasson is a Sabbath Observant Jew.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-53817075236676397602008-05-14T23:43:00.000+03:002008-05-14T23:43:00.000+03:00MK Menahem Ben-Sasson-- B.A. (with honors), Histor...MK Menahem Ben-Sasson-<BR/><BR/>- B.A. (with honors), History and Philosophy, Hebrew University, Jerusalem<BR/>- PhD, History of the Jewish People in the Islamic Lands, Hebrew University<BR/>- Research on Eastern Jewry<BR/>- Professor of the History of the Jewish Nation<BR/>- Post-Doctorate, Cambridge University<BR/><BR/>Born in Jerusalem, Ben-Sasson served in a Nahal unit in Ein Tzurim and in the artillery section during his national service in the IDF. <BR/><BR/>Fields of Research: Medieval Jewish history in Muslim lands. Social and intellectual history. Geonic Responsa and texts. Genizah research.<BR/><BR/>Academic Studies<BR/>1973-1975 The Heb. University Jewish Hist. , Jew. Phil., B.A.<BR/>1976-1982 The Heb. University Jewish Hist. + Islamic Studies, PhD<BR/>1983-1984 Cambridge University Genizah Research Unit Post Doc<BR/><BR/>Professional Experience in Academic Institutions:<BR/><BR/>Research and Teaching<BR/>1976-1979 The Heb. University Graduate assistant - Jew. History<BR/>1976-1978 Ben-Gurion University Graduate assistant - Jew. History<BR/>1980-1982 Bar-Ilan University Assistant Lecturer - Jew. History<BR/>1981-1982 The Heb. University Assistant Lecturer - Jew. History<BR/>1983-1984 Cambridge University Visiting Fellow Genizah Studies<BR/>1985-1995 The Ben-Zvi Institute Lecturer Hist. of Oriental Jews<BR/>1985-1987 The Heb. University Lecturer Jew. History<BR/>1986 BRGS Yeshiva Univers. Visiting Professor - Jew. History<BR/>1988-1991 The Heb. University Senior Lecturer - Jew. History<BR/>1991 (Summer) Oriental Institute Russian Academy of Science (Leningrad)<BR/>1991-1996 The Heb. University Assoc. Prof. - Jew. History<BR/>1994, 2003 UPENN -CJS Fellow<BR/>1996 HU - Advanced Studies Fellow<BR/>1996-now The Heb. University Prof. - Jew. History<BR/> Between 1997 and 2001 he served as rector of the Hebrew University, and represented the Association of University Heads at Knesset committees. He has also served on the board of directors at Yad Vashem, as president of the World Union of Jewish Studies, and is as vice-president of the Memorial Foundation for Jewish Culture.<BR/><BR/>Prior to the 2006 elections, Ben-Sasson was placed 20th on Kadima's list. With the party winning 29 seats, he entered the Knesset, and was appointed chairman of the Constitution, Law and Justice Committee. He also served as chairman of the Parliamentary Inquiry Committee on Wiretapping, and chairs the Lobby for Higher Education.<BR/><BR/>I do not see anywhere in Ben-Sasson's credentials "Rabbi", "Dayyan" or "Rosh Yeshiva". <BR/><BR/>Ben-Sasson's judgments regarding Psakim of the Beit Din Hagadol of Rav Sherman are about as relevant as a tax auditor's opinions on heart surgery. <BR/><BR/>Ben-Sasson's scholarhip of history does not qualify him as a halachic decisor, although I am sure he makes a fascinating dinner guest.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com