tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post7376195365080045638..comments2024-03-28T02:08:17.990+02:00Comments on Daas Torah - Issues of Jewish Identity: HaRav Eliashiv Protests Improper Methods Of Coercion In GittinDaas Torahhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07252904288544083215noreply@blogger.comBlogger37125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-12525559774639273392013-12-29T18:31:46.409+02:002013-12-29T18:31:46.409+02:00Reb Elyashev zt"l told me that any Beth Din t...Reb Elyashev zt"l told me that any Beth Din that invents ways to coerce husband loses its assumption of being a kosher Beth DIn.Dovid Eidensohnhttp://torahtimes.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-40898902783940146692013-12-25T22:47:19.939+02:002013-12-25T22:47:19.939+02:00Actually a long time ago I did speak to Rav Eliash...Actually a long time ago I did speak to Rav Eliashev, and he personally said in my presence that Borokovsky was fully shomer Torah u'Mitzvos from the time of his conversion until his death.Joenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-35670287437050541492013-12-25T19:52:08.458+02:002013-12-25T19:52:08.458+02:00Sorry Joe, you havent read the facts of the case. ...Sorry Joe, you havent read the facts of the case. Even RYSE would agree that he was no longer shomer Torah. Nobody disputed that. Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-24801830904452278602013-12-25T15:39:00.544+02:002013-12-25T15:39:00.544+02:00Mr. Borokovsky was fully shomer Torah u'Mitzvo...Mr. Borokovsky was fully shomer Torah u'Mitzvos from the time of his conversion until his death.Joenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-85643381094423056412013-12-25T05:25:11.542+02:002013-12-25T05:25:11.542+02:00Eddie is correct. I think ROY is the only one con...Eddie is correct. I think ROY is the only one consistent on this issue. He opposed the annulment in the Langer case and in the Sherman case.<br /><br />That said, we should not be disrespectful of Goren. He was an illui. Rav Isser Zalman Meltzer stood up when he walked in the room at the age of 18! Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-2217964237259159992013-12-25T04:56:03.662+02:002013-12-25T04:56:03.662+02:00@ Nat Sower,
@ Lakewood Yeshivahman,
Where is you...@ Nat Sower,<br />@ Lakewood Yeshivahman,<br /><br />Where is your hakoras hatov? Torah states veosiso es hayoshor vehatov. No thank you, no nothing? You were very makpid to see the written word, neise sefer venechzeh el mechzeh. I toiled, delivered the goods as promised and not even a toda? Ugh, ugh, ugh, vechi kach ossim libnei livay? Ayay yay yay....Halo tishali Sharei dmoos ninali, palgei mayim yordi einay al lo shomru...noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-59122907750006581082013-12-25T02:48:45.765+02:002013-12-25T02:48:45.765+02:00Dress - from where do u get your facts? The Yated ...Dress - from where do u get your facts? The Yated story? Yes, they claim he was a Jew in every respect, but it is untrue to say he always kept halacha. He was treif and didnt know anything. He went to shul sometimes, but that doesn't mean he kept halacha - was a social club for him. the issue is that in those days, dayanim did not like to annul giur, but today they do it willy nilly. <br /><br />Now it is an old story and quite a long one. Nobody has said that Borok'y kept halacha. The dispute is over whether or not his giur was valid or not.<br />The proof that this is political is from dayan Sherman's wholesale annulments of geirim he knew nothing about. If you were to be intellectually honest - which I know is difficult for Yated readers, you would see that Dayan Sherman did exactly what R Goren did, but 1000x as much - and he still had support form Dayan Elyashiv. <br />I say it's all political - and by the way, so did Rav Henkin.Ben MIkrahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07122937371918515052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-82036673883249482022013-12-25T00:52:57.091+02:002013-12-25T00:52:57.091+02:00Borokovsky always kept halacha. There was never an...Borokovsky always kept halacha. There was never any question as to his religiosity. It only became an issue when Goren was looking to invent an issue.Dressnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-43336593240550721962013-12-24T19:48:36.784+02:002013-12-24T19:48:36.784+02:00Borokovsky, although a non observant goy who ate t...Borokovsky, although a non observant goy who ate treif, did have a Jewish son, since his "wife" was Jewish. His son had a barmitzvah. From this, the BD considered him to be Jewish. I have no desire to criticise the original BD in this case - it was formed of 3 major Gedolim who represented 3 important sectors of Orthodoxy - ROY - sephardic; RSYE - Haredi ashkenazi, and R' Shaul Yisraeli - Dati Leumi. If anything I would be critical of R' Goren's chutzpah of going against such a mega-BD. My point is that you can't have it both ways - if Langer kids were mamzerim, then thousands of Sherman kids may also be mamzerim.Ben MIkrahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07122937371918515052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-53231923854898422692013-12-24T18:50:22.407+02:002013-12-24T18:50:22.407+02:00Tuli - you are talking nonsense, Firstly, Langer ...Tuli - you are talking nonsense, Firstly, Langer was the jewish by birth guy who maried the woman and was hence suspected of producing mamzerim. The "ger" was called Borokovsky. he was a Polish goy, who kept nothing. <br />He kept 100% treif. They lived in the jewish girl's parent's attic, and cooked chazir in the bathroom.<br />Next, he was tested by Bosei Din, he was unable to complete the sentence "Shema Yisrael...". So he knew less, and kept less than the alleged "russian goyim" that Mr Sherman has posulled.<br />Borokovsky was just a pawn caught up in a game between old enemies , R Elyahsiv and the Steipler on one hand, and R Goren on the other. <br />It is clear that this kind of machlokes is still goign on today, but now it it within the Litvish camp, eg between R Kanievsky jr. and R' Auerbach jr. The insults going back and forth between these Lithuanian towns are more severe than what they ever dared to crack against R Goren.Ben MIkrahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07122937371918515052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-11237818709136567072013-12-24T18:04:52.430+02:002013-12-24T18:04:52.430+02:00Tuli,
That is not true at all. Read the facts of ...Tuli,<br />That is not true at all. Read the facts of the case. He couldnt even finish the sentence "Shema Yisrael..." Surely a man who kept 100% would have said that pasuk thousands of times a year. There is overwhelming evidence against what you are saying. Even so, I am not supporting Goren. I am saying that Sherman and Elyashiv are invalidating conversions that are much stronger than Langer and that is a hypocrisy.Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-84913200816805719232013-12-24T16:20:43.703+02:002013-12-24T16:20:43.703+02:00Langer kept 100% from the time of his conversion. ...Langer kept 100% from the time of his conversion. There was never even the slightest doubt of his Jewishness until Mr. Goren needed some kind of tool to kasher his mamzers.Tulinoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-80778487684580219402013-12-24T07:51:28.377+02:002013-12-24T07:51:28.377+02:00We all know that, as he has stated many times, Rab...We all know that, as he has stated many times, Rabbi Dovid Eidenson is an authority on everything because he is a musmach of Rav Elyashiv's. I wonder if anyone can tell me who the Rabbis who argue on his shitta in what is called a Get MeUsah are musmachim from, namely vis a vis Dodelson/Weiss, Rabbis Kamenetzky, Miller & say, Greenblatt?Yakovnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-88184576633333056802013-12-24T06:09:16.633+02:002013-12-24T06:09:16.633+02:00Yogato motzoso taamin.
Kindly google, and SEE Docu...Yogato motzoso taamin.<br />Kindly google, and SEE Document of R' Kemenetsky of cease and desist.<br />Bemide deavidei leisgaliyei, lo meshakrei inshei, vechi ma li leshaker?<br /><br /><br /><br />http://daattorah.blogspot.com/2013/12/weiss-dodelson-rav-shmuel-kaminetsky.html#uds-search-results<br /><br />Monday, December 2, 2013<br />Weiss Dodelson: Rav Shmuel Kaminetsky "Smear campaign against the Weiss Family should cease and desist"<br />Rav Shmuel Kaminetsky released this letter on Friday November 29, 2013 <br /><br /><br />..... LETTER .....<br /><br />Guest Post from a concerned friend of the Weiss Family<br /><br /><br />This letter is far more important than one may think<br /><br /><br />Rav Shmuel writes that “as of two weeks ago, serious negotiations have been underway to resolve the Weiss-Dodelson, dispute” and therefore the “public smear campaign against the Weiss family...should cease and desist. It is unacceptable."<br /><br /><br />Weiss supporters are delighted that Rav Shmuel has taken a public stance after he and his son Rav Sholom have over the past two weeks experienced first hand how the Dodelsons “negotiate in good faith."<br /><br /> <br />**************************************************************<br /><br /><br />.....<br />114 comments:<br />Joe OrlowDecember 2, 2013 at 11:31 AM<br />This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.<br />...<br /> .......<br />Pursuit of HonestyDecember 9, 2013 at 6:47 PM<br /><br />Please answer some of the following questions: What were the hazmanos sent about? Did Weiss respond to those hazmanos or did ignore them? Was the bais din from Weiss' city? What right did the bais din have to write a siruv (based on the correct answers to the above questions)? Was there bitul siruv written? What was the Kol Korei based on? Who backed out of negotiations?<br />Now in case you don't know the correct answers I'll gladly give you a short overview.<br />The Bais Din sent hazmanos regarding Arkaos (not about a Get). Weiss responded to Bais Din saying that he chose a Borer. When Bais Din ignored his response - for some unknown reason - he said he would like to use Zablah. Halachicly both of those responses are enough to knock the Bais Din out, instead they ignored them and wrote a Siruv. Halachicly the Bais Din should be from the defendant's city, another reason why this Bais Din has no jurisdiction over this case. Since the Bais Din wrote a Siruv, the got a Bitul Siruv, so either way there is no current Siruv. So what was kol Korei written about? The case has nothing to do with a Get just yet. It's quite apparent that the Kol Korei was written with a complete misconception, and R' Shmuel's letter is testifying to that. There were negotiations going on for years but the Dodelsons chose to go to the post instead. See Rabbi Greenwald's 4 emails/letters, R' Dovid's psak, the hazmanos, the hasrah, the responses by Weiss to the bais din, the Siruv, the Kol Korei,<br /> R' Shmuel's letter, ====> R' Shlomo Miller's letter, <======<br /><br />the court documents, and most importantly the Shulchan Aruch, seder ha'Get with the Rama, for sources. And see ask of the above before responding!<br /><br />zehu ze! Yoter lo tuchal lachlov mimenu.<br />Shaarei demoos: Asher yomar alav ki hu zenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-59094394118807235352013-12-24T04:51:19.514+02:002013-12-24T04:51:19.514+02:00Sorry, but I have read R' K's letter in it...Sorry, but I have read R' K's letter in it's entirety, in the original, signed by him yes, here on this very blog, you can ask both R' Eidensohns. No need to ask bloggers. I cannot use the general search, only by blogging each and every one in prior of this abovementioned date. You are more than welcome to do it yourself, as the good book says, mitzva boi yoiser mibeshlicho, fershteist. If you still don't care to believe me, ich vell blaiben un kein babben. And just one more request, once you have it confirmed, please acknowledge it, thank you.Sharei emes veyatzivnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-49256812261002466182013-12-24T03:29:03.570+02:002013-12-24T03:29:03.570+02:00M and Ben,
You raise some serious concerns which, ...M and Ben,<br />You raise some serious concerns which, if true, would be very problematic. However, when ROY was made aware of those concerns, he did not feel they were legitimate. He backed up R' Druckman. None of the other people even spoke to him.<br /><br />R' Druckman's conversions are way way more legitimate than Langer and in that case, the very case which caused Rav elyashiv to quit the rabanut.Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-63655799828009538812013-12-24T03:26:19.478+02:002013-12-24T03:26:19.478+02:00The only ones I know who disregard S"A are th...The only ones I know who disregard S"A are the MO. And not even limited only to MO extremists; but rather mainstream MP pick-and-choose when to disregard S"A.Patnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-76018855292695428132013-12-24T01:36:47.832+02:002013-12-24T01:36:47.832+02:00No Ben, there was one clerical error when R' ...No Ben, there was one clerical error when R' Druckman was in Europe. So you expand it, giving eidut sheker, that Druckman was always in Europe.<br />Next, "he supposedly converting Russian goyim in Israel in beis din in Israel ". Yeah, right, Since you can't convert jews, then the object of a conversion, by necessity, must be a goy.<br />Oh, so you "know" that none of the thousands kept a single mitzvah? How do you know this, by survey? Or by reading yated? Even Dayan Sherman didnt know this, he did not look at the files of any single convert, and he nullified en masse, cases that he had know knowledge of. This is a mockery of the entire Hareid world, its over-reaction to the Langer case, and it calls into question whether Sherman is actually carrying out his duties of dayanut according to halacha.Ben MIkrahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07122937371918515052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-85706709008944784452013-12-24T01:20:25.947+02:002013-12-24T01:20:25.947+02:00This is not a judgement on a particular case, it&#...This is not a judgement on a particular case, it's on an entire class of geirus. When an entire class of people (based on origin and motivation, in this case) do not keep mitzvos, it is a fair assumption that the geirus was a sham to begin with Ariel Sharon set quotas for Russian immigrants to convert, in order to maintain the state's "Jewish" identity. The Russians' motivation for going along with it was for citizenship and army purposes. The Russians' motivation for going along with it was for citizenship and army purposes. Their "kabalas ol mitzvos" was a complete formality and a sham. Their insincerity was evident from the outset, and they were completely nonobservant from the moment their "conversions" were done. Their "kabalas ol mitzvos" was a complete formality and a sham. Their insincerity was evident from the outset, and they were completely nonobservant from the moment their "conversions" were done.<br /><br />Mnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-7141466738463845912013-12-24T01:08:55.413+02:002013-12-24T01:08:55.413+02:00It is funny how the haredi extremists disregard th...It is funny how the haredi extremists disregard the SA when it does not agree with them or when they do not agree with it.Ben MIkrahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07122937371918515052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-29491460643995265582013-12-24T00:25:42.970+02:002013-12-24T00:25:42.970+02:00Read the Bitul Seruv for Aharon. He makes factual...Read the Bitul Seruv for Aharon. He makes factual determinations on the basis of a diary entry without meeting or speaking to Tamar. I cited this as an example in which he is in violation of the Shulchan Aruch. Stan spoke to him and he said that if there is "raglayim ladavar" (her diary entry with no context whatsoever or chance to explain) he doesnt need to speak to her.<br />He could have pointed out the procedural flaws and still be mevatel the seruv but he went further than that. He ruled and made determinations about Tamar without meeting the evidentiary standard Rav Elyashiv requires.Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-91809220827236982922013-12-24T00:19:41.960+02:002013-12-24T00:19:41.960+02:00Ben Torah,
Each case has to be evaluated individu...Ben Torah, <br />Each case has to be evaluated individually. ROY approved of the Druckman conversions. Certainly the approval of someone of his stature should give you pause before declaring them all void. <br />Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-35038457456025530472013-12-24T00:10:44.496+02:002013-12-24T00:10:44.496+02:00Anything written can only be considered retracted ...Anything written can only be considered retracted via the written word. Anything less is plainly insufficient. The fact that a blogger claims there was a retraction is meaningless.<br />I am sure there are many of rabbi Miller's supporters/family who were highly embarrassed by his position (a feeling they may be used to having) and, in an attempt to cover up for his abjectly pathetic "follow malkiel at all costs" position, will claim to have heard a retraction. <br />Sorry, insufficient. If you want to be taken seriously, produce a written retraction, otherwise this claim will be banished to the scrapheap of hearsay.Lakewood Yeshivahmannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-20051507782996844452013-12-23T23:20:52.533+02:002013-12-23T23:20:52.533+02:00Daer Bloggers,
Here is a partial of what I retrie...Daer Bloggers,<br /> Here is a partial of what I retrieved from past blog.<br /><br />Wednesday, December 11, 2013<br />Weiss-Dodelson: A relative of the Weiss family protests against Dodelson's chilul Hashem<br />....<br />Please keep in mind that Rabbi Shmuel Kamenetzky has declared that the Dodelson's need to stop their "smear campaign" against the Weisses. The facebook page is still up. The website is still up. The Dodelson's are making public that they used Reb Shmuel's Halachic knowledge to support their cause, and discarded and disregarded it when they had no further use for it.<br /><br /><br />We need to stand against the Dodelson's not for the Weisses sake, but for the sake of our Torah and the Halacha that they are trampling.<br /><br /><br />Please call the Dodelson's at the following numbers and ask them to follow Reb Shmuel's psak and take down the website and facebook page. If you are brave (or foolhardy?) post your name, your actual name on this webpage. Let us band together and show each other that those who follow Halacha can succeed.<br /><br />Please forgive, it is a painstaking search, and this is yet not the best snapshot, veidach zil ugmor. I am sure some bloggers can attest, as well as help you out.<br /><br /> veitcha haslicha!<br />Sharei demoosnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-12907572396850216342013-12-23T21:50:55.113+02:002013-12-23T21:50:55.113+02:00Rav Gestetner never said anything like that and he...Rav Gestetner never said anything like that and he does not disagree.Dressnoreply@blogger.com