tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post7007880282077955244..comments2024-03-29T09:34:59.827+03:00Comments on Daas Torah - Issues of Jewish Identity: Weiss-Dodelson: Did the Weiss family lie about Rabbi Greenwald's involvement?Daas Torahhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07252904288544083215noreply@blogger.comBlogger75125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-15830597800519225462013-11-25T04:44:24.656+02:002013-11-25T04:44:24.656+02:00James, what Ben Torah said is a point made by ever...James, what Ben Torah said is a point made by everyone familiar with this case. The siruv was never valid. This point has been made from the day after the so-called siruv was issued. See the Weiss documents on this blog put up by Rabbi Eidensohn in July 2012.Haim Goldsteinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-4351852993793763102013-11-25T00:52:13.817+02:002013-11-25T00:52:13.817+02:00Part 3 of response to Richie Sevrinsky said:
In d...Part 3 of response to <b>Richie Sevrinsky said:<br /><br />In divorce cases, BOTH husband and wife and their families are seeking FINANCIAL SETTLEMENTS and AGREEMENTS about who gets to keep what and who pays what to whom.<br /><br />It is no different in a get. <br /><br />When you have complications each side may present claims and counter claims in court or in bais din. Expand your notion of what a bais din is and what it can take under its jurisdiction.<br /><br />Finally, the really complicated part is what is the fate of children of divorcing parents (they will always be the final victims no matter what the arrangements, speak to any counselor or mental health expert) and children are after all human beings and cannot be "divided" as one would a an inanimate object. <br /><br />That is where the concept arises of child custody, child support, visitation rights and the roles of professionals and spiritual leaders in mediating all this.<br /><br />The Dodelson, by "simplifying" and in a sense "romanticizing" this as a 1+1=2 "equation" IN PUBLIC when it it is not that, are not doing themselves favors. In this case, the other side claims that it has incurred costs or legal fees (them's the facts no one change), and that is the way many cases are settled with one side or the other having to pay costs of the other side. Hey it's a bargain if you are generating millions of bucks and money is no objection and if you could have freed up your daughter four years ago. <br /><br />Just how cruel can you be to your own child, when coughing up could allow them to get on with life, avoid the recrimination, running to the New York Post (of all the tabloids) and all the headaches of double-edged "ten minutes of fame" that will not be worth your while when you have better and bigger things to do, like get on with life. <br /><br />And hey, you cannot keep or KIDNAP someone else's baby even if you are the mother, because the father of that baby is also a human being with his own attachments feelings and rights to HIS bay as well get your head around that, it's also as simple as 1+1=2. <br /><br />So work on that and come up with a reasonable solution instead of raising hell and creating all this noise spinning your wheels and going nowhere fast.<br /><br />"<i>It seems the only matter of disagreement is whether these tactics are sanctioned by the Torah.</i>"<br /><br />RaP: More simple talk from you. The Feinteins and the Weisses are NOT "less" aware or less committed to the Torah way of doing things than are the Dodelsons. This is obviously a complicated struggle involving two obstinate sides with neither side willing to give in. <br /><br />Something must be done by ALL concerned ASAP to stop this tug of war taking place on a very slippery slope for all of them that will only land them all in even deeper dirt and mudslinging.</b>Recipients and Publicitynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-54835014454679809572013-11-25T00:49:42.844+02:002013-11-25T00:49:42.844+02:00Part 2 of response to Richie Sevrinsky said:
Don&...Part 2 of response to <b>Richie Sevrinsky said:<br /><br />Don't you realize that in Talmudic Judaism EVERYTHING can be and is reduced to it's MONETARY value. <br /><br />People, property and situations and much more, the whole notion of damages "nezikin" and how it plays out in secular court and bais din can and are summed up and REDUCED to monetary terms. <br /><br />That's a reality you seem NOT to know about or perhaps just deliberately ignoring. <br /><br />In this case, yes, it's obvious, one of the parties (for their own legal and Halachic reasons that they feel is justified and that they can obviously defend) is requesting a payment of a sum of money in order to grant a "release", whether it is 35 cents, 35 dollars or 35 million, is not the point, it is the reality that that is what one side is requesting in this legal and Halachic situation, and they are entitled to do that since a get is not just about getting a "quickie" divorce, it is part of a bigger picture of unraveling all the threads of a marriage between two upper-crust families, a matter that comes before a kosher bais din, and in that bais din the parties can and do enter into all sorts of negotiations as they would in secular court. <br /><br />You seem to have the simplistic view that the bais din is just a rubber stamp to facilitate a get, when in reality the bais can take in the global situation of all factors if the need arises and in this case it has.<br /><br />It does not help if one party short circuits the negotiations and the entire system by running to other rival batei din or rabbis they can hire to give a point of view they like to get "injunctions" and all sorts of self-serving "decrees" that the other side will not recognize, and this is true for either side, they must ALL enter into good faith negotiations under the aegis of the best neutral bais din when it becomes complicated like this. It is done and it can be done and hopefully it will be done very soon.<br /><br />ANY marriage is NOT just the culmination of a romance that results "happily living after" it is ALSO a BUSINESS relationship. <br /><br />Right under the chupa the Kesuba is read out loud and it is all about the "net worth" of the bride and the agreement of groom to support her. If they make other arrangements, like the wife supporting the husband in Kollel for ten years as is common in Lakewood-type marriages, then that is also part of the business deal. <br /><br />There may be pre-nups, post-nups and no-nups, but the financial-monetary aspect of marriage is there. <br /><br />There are "oral understandings" that are just as equally binding as written ones between a couple and their families. When two powerful dynasties "merge" as in this case, there are also co-concomitant POLITICAL issues, as in the marriage between two royal houses then questions of ownership of the realm, who is "senior" or "junior" for example, in the case of the Queen Elizabeth of England, her husband Prince Phillip is junior, while in the case of Prince Charles, his late wife Princess Diana was the junior and when they divorced the title of "princess" was taken away from her.<br /><br />Where their is money and wealth involved this involves serious questions of assets and how they will be owned. Usually at this stage lawyers are needed because it gets very murky and complicated. But GOOD batei din could still with this if they were allowed to.<br /><br />It should also be obvious that the same goes for a divorce when parties have to split their formerly common assets, that is why they go to court and bais din and they can either be AMICABLE or NASTY settlements.</b>Recipients and Publicitynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-28670784426102470802013-11-25T00:46:36.964+02:002013-11-25T00:46:36.964+02:00Part 1 of response to Richie Sevrinsky said: "...Part 1 of response to <b>Richie Sevrinsky said: "<i>@Recipients and Publicity: I appreciate your agreement on the matter of whether Gital Dodelson is being held hostage, and the Dodelsons are being extorted to the tune of $350,000.</i>"<br /><br />RaP: AND -->you<-- ignore that the Dodelson's, with their rough-and-tough in-your-face counter-responses scorched Earth "fire the bums" tactics, have TOTALLY failed to win their daughter's freedom.<br /><br />Instead the proverbial "noose" is now tighter around her neck as she struggles in vain to free herself and it is pathetic to watch, while her parents and family and bought-off rabbis are willing to have her twist in the wind and go through such suffering for FOUR years.<br /><br />If it was the daughter of RATIONAL people they would surely have raised as much money to get her freedom ASAP and not tangle with one's enemies especially since they know the Halacha better than you, give them the money and run as fast as you can for your life, and work out reasonable visitation rights because one should not be so stupid to say that the great rabbis in my ex's family will "harm" my child. And in this case money is not the problem. <br /><br />But there is also the factor of the child that the Dodelsons want all to themselves and that GITAL RAN OFF WITH which itself is against the Halacha because THAT MAKES HER B O T H A KIDNAPPER (in Jewish law a kidnapper is akin to a murderer!!!) in the eyes of not just her ex and she is also a moredes a REBELLIOUS wife who fled her marriage without informing her husband and evidently in the middle of marital therapy (what was she afraid of? that her problems would be revealed and she would have to admit her own human failings) because fleeing like that is deserving of its own serious sanctions and in civil law it is also questionable if she gets all the rights since it is not clear what exactly her husband was doing that she did not like (what she told the papers cannot be trusted because that may or may not be pure sensationalism and needs to be verified.) <br /><br />You know something, you are so naive (of course, then again, you may be one of those publicists that the Doldelson's have hired) and you sound like a total SIMPLETON when you talk of divorces and a get in such simplistic terms when the reality is far more complicated.</b>Recipients and Publicitynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-21335815261712297402013-11-25T00:30:01.363+02:002013-11-25T00:30:01.363+02:00Ben,
Nobody agrees with you. Even Rav Dovid says ...Ben,<br />Nobody agrees with you. Even Rav Dovid says that the seruv is nullified by agreement to arbitrate. He does not say that the seruv was never vaild - otherwise, there would be no need to agree to binding arbitration.Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-39018116532038007192013-11-25T00:25:00.177+02:002013-11-25T00:25:00.177+02:00"1) This marriage is over and a therefore a g..."1) This marriage is over and a therefore a get should be forthcoming, end of story. Any disputes about money and custody needs to be had without the husband using the get as leverage. It is disturbing to me that Rabbi E does not seem to even remotely hold this position, quite the contrary. "<br /><br />2) Whether the Dodelson family were right or wrong to go the secular press none of us are in a position to judge them since their daughter is being murdered daily, pshuto kamashmao, by having the fertile years of her life stolen from her. Her life is being held to ransom over money, and all of us would do anything needed to get a loved one out of that situation.<br /><br /><br />Feinschmeker what planet do you live on? There is no chiyuv for him to give a get. It would only be unethical if she had behaved herself and not stopped him seeing his child. Once a woman uses the child as leverage it is not only muttar to use the get as leverage but a chiyuv. there is a mitzva of "lo saamod al dam reicho" which applies to your child and yourself as much as to your neighbor. Anyone naive to think that you can give a get and still get fair treatment is delusional to put it mildly.<br /><br />While there are those who may debate whether AMW followed halocho properly and generally speaking this should be the paramount concern, we live in a totally hefker veldt and the women are advised by fake gedolim to violate halocho and are supported and encouraged to do so. <br /><br />What is clear is that this "very refined bas yisroel" with these wierd hashkofos on life wants to eliminate AMW from his son's life which itself is a huge breach in halocho. That she deliberately not only started this whole business by trying to reduce/ eliminate AMW from child's life and then followed through with a multi-year long process, even if from the dinim of arko"oys he can't get her to pay, he probably can from the dinim of genaivoh and mazik. <br /><br />If she was so worried about her fertile years, she would have stayed married. if she was so worried about her fertile years, she would have ended the case quickly. if she were so worried about her reputation and her son's well being she also would have done the right thing and granted the father joint legal and residential custody.<br /><br />All these concerns for these pitiful women are basically just the yetzer hora and baseless. <br />agudah = zionismnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-32979149590373560972013-11-24T23:34:24.568+02:002013-11-24T23:34:24.568+02:00Boy are you a loon. Obviously an ORA supporter or ...Boy are you a loon. Obviously an ORA supporter or a Dodelson. <br />A get is not given until all deals are worked out. If there is one thing we seem to know from this is that no side will give up its "power" in the interim.<br />Hopefully she won't have any more children until her hashkofas get straightened out a bit. Unless she is looking to have children out of wedlock. <br />Obvious drivel from an ORA/Dodelson supporter. The chilul hashem is completely on the Dodelsons and their supporters. <br />You obviously can not comprehend what you are reading. However, I can't make heads or tails out of Greenwald either. So, I will give you something there. <br />The rabbis are either all involved or all pasul in this story. Your call. One side isnt better than the other one. <br />The one thing I do know from this is that the Dodelsons are skipping lots of info. Weiss is the plaintiff they say but their docs show him as defendant even in the final custody. The BD is a sham. However, four years are enough. But, I started by thinking he was a control freak. Now I think she is bipolar. I would rather have the kid with the control freak. Don't you agree?make a little sense pleasenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-92163276358565202862013-11-24T20:56:33.983+02:002013-11-24T20:56:33.983+02:00"1) This marriage is over and a therefore a g..."1) This marriage is over and a therefore a get should be forthcoming, end of story. Any disputes about money and custody needs to be had without the husband using the get as leverage."<br /><br />But why do you say this, when the Halacha says otherwise? Don't orthodox Jews go by the halacha?<br /><br />"It is disturbing to me that Rabbi E does not seem to even remotely hold this position, quite the contrary. "<br /><br />That shouldn't be disturbing at all considering Rabbi E's consistent history of intellectual honesty and pursuit of the truth directly from the sources and the poskim. He is trying to stick to the halachic approach, as is his custom. I don't see what Rabbi E has done that is any different from what he's done in the past or in any way sheds a negative light on him. It seems to me he is calmly and assertively disproving the "Get On Demand" folks and educating the rest of us that actually there is no halachic validity to "Get On Demand." Given the role of media, PR firms, and "activists" in pushing the Get On Demand message, Rabbi E's careful intellectual discussion of this issue has added much needed context for someone like me who knew very little of this subject beyond media soundbites.Student of Judaismnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-85444256291190284512013-11-24T20:55:53.023+02:002013-11-24T20:55:53.023+02:00Amen, Mr Feinshmecker!
I too have been a long-tim...Amen, Mr Feinshmecker!<br /><br />I too have been a long-time reader of this blog and have come away depressed from these postings and the comments that follow.<br /><br />Names like Daas Torah and Ben Torah and Recipients and Publicity (with his many words, all in bold type, and often in CAPS) personally attacking anyone who doesn't agree.<br /><br />They are right that i do not know nearly the amount of Torah and halacha they do -- but, i come away wondering: Is this the same Judasim that i practice? <br /><br />Mr. Feinshmecker, my humble advice would be for us to walk away from this blog before the ground opens up beneath it and accidentally swallows us up with the others.<br /><br />It's der golus.<br />- AndrewAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-22222369450851155842013-11-24T19:04:11.867+02:002013-11-24T19:04:11.867+02:00Hear hear....Hear hear....Disappointed in HNnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-19349839996527611012013-11-24T18:27:10.836+02:002013-11-24T18:27:10.836+02:00If a wife is halachicly wronging her husband in th...If a wife is halachicly wronging her husband in the divorce process, the husband has every halachic right to delay giving her the Get until she ceases her wrongful actions against him and reverses the damage she caused her husband.MGnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-56467866859197783042013-11-24T18:26:18.862+02:002013-11-24T18:26:18.862+02:00I replied to the inaccuracies of your double-post ...I replied to the inaccuracies of your double-post below your duplicate post below.MGnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-71114473655438214522013-11-24T18:24:48.503+02:002013-11-24T18:24:48.503+02:00browser: With the Dodelsons shedding Weiss' bl...browser: With the Dodelsons shedding Weiss' blood with their secular media campaign and slander, it is every Jew's obligation to defend the Weiss.MGnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-7196035954446613322013-11-24T18:16:58.479+02:002013-11-24T18:16:58.479+02:00Clearly this dispute is NOT a simple fight over wh...Clearly this dispute is NOT a simple fight over who should pay the hundreds of thousands of dollars in legal costs incurred by the Weiss'. If that's all it was, the dirt-rich Dodelson's would have long ago paid it and gotten over it. Instead the Dodelson's paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to wage a media campaign, hire the irreligious Shira Dicker as a public relations consultant on a halachic dispute, gone to all sorts of media, created Facebook pages, a highly slick freegiral website, gotten letters of support, etc. etc. Stuff that costs big bucks.<br /><br />The Dodelsons are already spending big bucks to wage their war against the Weiss'. So this is not simply a matter of them not wanting to pay and get over it. To the Dodelsons this is a honor war. Something they will fight to the death just for their pride. Even if Gital is the bloody loser whose body ends up lifeless on the ground, unable to remarry while she grows old and grey all lonely and all by herself with no husband ever by her side.MGnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-32506147719310841942013-11-24T18:09:06.430+02:002013-11-24T18:09:06.430+02:00There never was any valid seruv as the beis din th...There never was any valid seruv as the beis din that issued it was only accepted by one side and thus had no jurisdiction over the case. This is a case for zabla as requested by the litigants.Ben Torahnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-85587527197079696672013-11-24T17:59:21.511+02:002013-11-24T17:59:21.511+02:00AMW was never a mesarev ledin since he never agree...AMW was never a mesarev ledin since he never agreed to the jurisdiction of the beis din that issued that siruv. He gave a borer for another beis din and thus was only subject to zabla.Ben Torahnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-34965744936559789902013-11-24T17:56:55.526+02:002013-11-24T17:56:55.526+02:00I am disappointed by this turn of events in this b...I am disappointed by this turn of events in this blog. I have read it for years and much admire the bravery of dear Rabbi E's willingness to take nuanced positions that may often be uncomfortable for a man in his position.<br /><br />A few things are obvious:<br /><br />1) This marriage is over and a therefore a get should be forthcoming, end of story. Any disputes about money and custody needs to be had without the husband using the get as leverage. It is disturbing to me that Rabbi E does not seem to even remotely hold this position, quite the contrary. <br /><br />2) Whether the Dodelson family were right or wrong to go the secular press none of us are in a position to judge them since their daughter is being murdered daily, pshuto kamashmao, by having the fertile years of her life stolen from her. Her life is being held to ransom over money, and all of us would do anything needed to get a loved one out of that situation.<br /><br />3) Just as in the cases of child abuse that are discussed here, the chilul hashem is not the publication of the victims complaints, but the acts that lead to the complaints. <br /><br />4) The revelation from the arbitrator makes it clear that one side has certainly been deceptive over critical issues that effect this discourse.<br /><br />5) The words of rabbonim, no matter what their pedigree, who are blatantly nogea badavar in the most fundamental way, are worse than worthless, and the absurdity that they were even issued could be argued to cast doubt on their own judgement in general.<br /><br />I very much hope that this clear lapse of judgement is not due to Rabbi E's own personal opinions but is just due to his own personal connections and negois...I hope that he soon overcomes this nisayon and comes to his senses, since this case is not just about the couple anymore.<br /><br />Voices, particularly from someone as influential and well regarded as the author as this blog, that seem to justify the use of a get to extort money and claw back defeats in arkaos, will only serve to embolden and normalize this type of behaviors in the yeshivishhe oilem, leading to even greater chilul hashem and more pain for many families.<br />Feinshmeckerhttp://aol.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-73729522337687308762013-11-24T17:55:57.747+02:002013-11-24T17:55:57.747+02:00I am disappointed by this turn of events in this b...I am disappointed by this turn of events in this blog. I have read it for years and much admire the bravery of dear Rabbi E's willingness to take nuanced positions that may often be uncomfortable for a man in his position.<br /><br />A few things are obvious:<br /><br />1) This marriage is over and a therefore a get should be forthcoming, end of story. Any disputes about money and custody needs to be had without the husband using the get as leverage. It is disturbing to me that Rabbi E does not seem to even remotely hold this position, quite the contrary. <br /><br />2) Whether the Dodelson family were right or wrong to go the secular press none of us are in a position to judge them since their daughter is being murdered daily, pshuto kamashmao, by having the fertile years of her life stolen from her. Her life is being held to ransom over money, and all of us would do anything needed to get a loved one out of that situation.<br /><br />3) Just as in the cases of child abuse that are discussed here, the chilul hashem is not the publication of the victims complaints, but the acts that lead to the complaints. <br /><br />4) The revelation from the arbitrator makes it clear that one side has certainly been deceptive over critical issues that effect this discourse.<br /><br />5) The words of rabbonim, no matter what their pedigree, who are blatantly nogea badavar in the most fundamental way, are worse than worthless, and the absurdity that they were even issued could be argued to cast doubt on their own judgement in general.<br /><br />I very much hope that this clear lapse of judgement is not due to Rabbi E's own personal opinions but is just due to his own personal connections and negois...I hope that he soon overcomes this nisayon and comes to his senses, since this case is not just about the couple anymore.<br /><br />Voices, particularly from someone as influential and well regarded as the author as this blog, that seem to justify the use of a get to extort money and claw back defeats in arkaos, will only serve to embolden and normalize this type of behaviors in the yeshivishhe oilem, leading to even greater chilul hashem and more pain for many families.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Feinshmeckerhttp://aol.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-24942784052942066902013-11-24T17:54:59.917+02:002013-11-24T17:54:59.917+02:00Yitz: Chareidi Yeshiva donors are not known for be...Yitz: Chareidi Yeshiva donors are not known for being big feminists.Ben Torahnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-90394865598094640632013-11-24T17:53:00.058+02:002013-11-24T17:53:00.058+02:00My point is that both the husband and wife must ag...My point is that both the husband and wife must agree to utilize beis din for ALL matters including custody, and then when beis din rules present b"d's decision to family court as the "agreed" to custody and property arrangements that the two of them agreed to.<br /><br />Of course this requires both of them present it to the secular judge as an agreement. And it is both their halachic duty to do so and live by the halachic and beis din decision.Ben Torahnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-76254503069011640432013-11-24T17:39:57.018+02:002013-11-24T17:39:57.018+02:00It is the veracity of Rav Dovid's assertion th...It is the veracity of Rav Dovid's assertion that is under discussion. You can not cite Rav Dovid as evidence for that.Jamesnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-34207034049691662942013-11-24T16:12:09.639+02:002013-11-24T16:12:09.639+02:00My contribution has been to encourage a quicker re...My contribution has been to encourage a quicker resolution.<br />================================================<br />Rabbi Eidensohn,are you serious? do you really believe that by plastering this private family feud on your blog would convince the antagonist's to resolve it quicker? me thinks'this is not the case' the real reason is,you want to attract clicks to you blog,and what better way than a real life frum jewish soap opera,<br />and by the way,i myself and hundreds of others had no idea about this sordid affair even though i live in brooklyn,it is only through your blog<br />did we learn about it,why you chose to call your blog "daas torah" is beyond me jackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06362441815954044213noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-84879410617839404422013-11-24T15:51:19.715+02:002013-11-24T15:51:19.715+02:00It wasn't binding arbitration, since dodelson ...It wasn't binding arbitration, since dodelson never signed as in the original plan. It could very well be, that it is not due to a final decision that R. G. already drafted up, only due to preconditions that Dodelson wanted to insert, and rejected by R.G. thereby aborted before full term. It is useless to keep on guessing and counterguessing on issues we have no privileges to stick our nose in to begin with. All this is only Atzat Yetzer HaORA ysv. Let it be executed by competent Rabbis al pi Torah, and the PR should stay out of it, for the good and benefit of all parties.maloh geronoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-49189507906263955712013-11-24T15:36:18.992+02:002013-11-24T15:36:18.992+02:00@ Yitz of November 24, 2013 at 12:08 PM
True, but...@ Yitz of November 24, 2013 at 12:08 PM<br />True, but only as a consequence to the initial alleged attacks. Elu hadvarim shehatzniut yafeh lahen, without quarreling J with J to begin with, let alone beGass uvchutzot Ashkelon, at the expense of Hashem veTorato, pen ta'aloizno benos hoarelois. ved"allemaan Hashem lo echshe, ulmaan Torato lo eshkotnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-84626030837298033372013-11-24T12:53:46.585+02:002013-11-24T12:53:46.585+02:00Rabbi Greenwald wrote "When the two of you [R...Rabbi Greenwald wrote "When the two of you [R' Zlotowitz and R Aron Kotler] agreed that I would be a good mediator, shaliach, askan, arbitrator or whatever word you want to use, I accepted that awesome responsibility because after meeting both families I believed that a resolution was achievable."<br /><br />Given that, perhaps the following thinking explains Rav Dovid's psak:<br /><br />In this letter, Rabbi Greenwald appears to me to be clarifying (thoroughly but with great deference) the facts underlying Rav David's psak. Several comments above have noted that even if the Dodelsons had agreed to either mediation or arbitration, the resulting resolution might not have stood in the divorce court. That cannot have been news to a posek of Rav Dovid's experience; something similar must surely have crossed his desk before. <br /><br />If that is correct, he must have considered the precise nature of the arrangements (or lack thereof as clarified by R' Greenwald) to be less relevant to the question of being mesarev ledin than the fact that the matter was under serious and active discussion by Avraham Weiss.Yoel Bnoreply@blogger.com