tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post4638856747121140266..comments2024-03-28T02:08:17.990+02:00Comments on Daas Torah - Issues of Jewish Identity: Rav Sternbuch - converting wife with invalid geirusDaas Torahhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07252904288544083215noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-64148842120242868052009-07-17T02:52:21.223+03:002009-07-17T02:52:21.223+03:00Bartley,
also make no mistake, there is much more...Bartley,<br /><br />also make no mistake, there is much more than the "video endrosement" that put's them far apart kirchok mizrach mimaarav!Roninoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-41072776811320449492009-07-17T02:30:07.569+03:002009-07-17T02:30:07.569+03:00BArtley,
"on the issue of pursuing intermarr...BArtley,<br /><br />"on the issue of pursuing intermarried people with conventions then why does he appear on a Video endorsement of EJF regarding these programs".<br /><br />Right on! He is part of the Organization! He is the President of the Halachik committee.<br /><br />But I would disagree with your characterization that was unfortunately brought by Dt:<br /><br />If you will see, he mistranlslates any word into "proselityzing". In one of the early letters (which were in general about a subject that does not seem to be part of the EJf's agenda the way the letter seemed to portray, it talked about accepting non jewsih children of jewish fathers to schools. I fail to see where EJF pursued strongly that agenda in any of the official websites and conventions. But that is another story for another time...to show that there was some miscommunication between some people to BADATZ and what was REALLY on the ground. But that is neither here or there) it said in hebrew "לעודד" and DT translated into "proselytizing". In a similar vein we have it here I am afraid that the word "pursuing intermarried couples" is innacurate. IT has a connotation that they push the people to convert. This is NOT TRUE.roninoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-52629396159968276632009-07-16T17:47:06.588+03:002009-07-16T17:47:06.588+03:00Bartley Kulp said...
What kind of shell game ...Bartley Kulp said...<br /><br /> What kind of shell game is being played here? If Rav Feinstein agrees with Rav Shernbach on the issue of pursuing intermarried people with conventions then why does he appear on a Video endorsement of EJF regarding these programs.<br />============<br />that is the real question. The only written teshuva from Rav Reuven does not mention anything about pursuing intermarried couples at conventions. <br /><br />In fact no one has come up with a statement endorsing them. R' Tropper however has said that Tom Kaplan was not happy with them. Why does Tom Kaplan have more sensitivy to Jewish law than R' Tropper?Daas Torahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07252904288544083215noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-30800964936510795332009-07-16T17:05:48.334+03:002009-07-16T17:05:48.334+03:00What kind of shell game is being played here? If R...What kind of shell game is being played here? If Rav Feinstein agrees with Rav Shernbach on the issue of pursuing intermarried people with conventions then why does he appear on a Video endorsement of EJF regarding these programs.Bartley Kulpnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-49623521331252203422009-07-16T16:14:40.939+03:002009-07-16T16:14:40.939+03:00Dt,
I don't know from where to start!
1) Fir...Dt,<br /><br />I don't know from where to start!<br /><br />1) First off all: How do *you* have any remez that Rav ELyashiv 3/140 talks about this situation? IT is so ludicrous to begin with, the whole sentence shows black on white that this is not what he talking about. He talks about someone who needs shirum to be encouraged to convert I. it is Kircho mizrach mimaarov from your scenario!<br /><br />2) You assertion now that this is Rav Sternbuch's only permission to convert vindicates what I'm telling you: that he is REJECTED by Rav MOshe, Rav Henkin, Rav Yaakov Kamenetsky, Rav Aurbach and most gedoyley hador who apply "takanat hashavim for many many more cases. They apply teshuvot Harambam which appleis to cases where there is some ulterior motive (leshem ishut) and still they permit it. Mah shey keyn in your case. <br /><br />Actually, youin your blog from it's ionception made one of your criticism about the etsem problem of covnerting intermarired couples. You brought your Rav EFrati's lettter and a (non relating) teshuva of Rav MOshe (which does not cover what ERJf does) and Achiezer (which also supports RT and not your position). It is clear that your initial position and your now vague position runs counter Rav MOshe, Henkin, Ayrbach etc. <br />3) Actually Rav Ruven in his letter talks about a case where they are willing to live by torah and mitzvot; however they reuire "kiruv" . Rav Sternbuch, from what he wrote in his letter that he signed with the eidah writes that this is NOT proper! And so Rav ELyashiv in his teshuva.<br /><br />4) I would like to add to the discussion : You have many allies who criticize other aspects of Rt's conversion method. They are disagreeing with Rav Sternbuch who wrote in his first letter that "Although they FIX ONE AREA IN GERUT nevertheless...."; he acknowledged that the claim. You alliance with them runs counter the BaDATZ and Rav Sternbuch.<br /><br />5)I would like to add:even your main valid argument (that I disagree with your war over it; and i disagree that there are no endorsmenet to Rt for it; becuasse Rav Ruven endorses it by being the President of the Halachik Comitte at the ORganization! and is respnsible for what is known to the public about it's doing and he never ever came out against this and most importantly has not changed this goal, (while some other issues thatI agree with you: the innapropriteness of some of the stupid articles about conversion to Judaism that appeared randomly) so he certainly agrees with Rt andis BEHIND IT! )does not have any WRITTEN LETTER OR PSSAK THAT ADDRESSES IT HEAD ON. IOW: I want you to bring a letter that clearly forbids teaching an intermarried couple the value ofyiddishkeyt, especially teaching the jewish partner. <br /><br />to be conitnuedroninoreply@blogger.com