tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post3743277284485562364..comments2024-03-28T02:08:17.990+02:00Comments on Daas Torah - Issues of Jewish Identity: Schlesinger Twins: The Vienna community suffers from deafness and a stone heartDaas Torahhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07252904288544083215noreply@blogger.comBlogger26125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-3496241178482988122014-03-24T17:49:24.434+02:002014-03-24T17:49:24.434+02:00The rabbis in England wrote very respectful letter...The rabbis in England wrote very respectful letters (above) to the rabbis in Austria about a disturbing matter affecting one of their flock who moved to Vienna.<br /><br />The rabbis in Austria didn't even have the courtesy to reply to the rabbis in England. That is highly disrespectful.<br /><br />The question stands, why are the rabbis in Austria so disrespectful of the esteemed rabbis in England?<br /><br />Avrohomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-87445233281631360122014-03-24T15:52:35.778+02:002014-03-24T15:52:35.778+02:00Hi Brav - thanks for your polite question. It app...Hi Brav - thanks for your polite question. It appears that the mother is having all kinds of obstacles put in her way from having regular access to the boys. Also, it does seem rather perverse that she has to pay for the privilege of seeing her own children. I am, therefore, more sympathetic to her. <br /><br />However, when it comes to the court's decision (and my own, admittedly tangential, knowledge of her) I am still very sceptical about her version of events both leading up to and subsequent to the court's decision. I still find it hard to believe that there is a conspiracy involving the Austrian police, social services, day child care supervisors, two levels of court, the official Jewish community and all the women of that community. Much of her support seems to come from people living many hundreds (if not thousands of miles) away with a direct and current connection to her family but a distance (both spatially and temporally) from Beth herself. Not to mention some of the emotional, if not - dare I say it - hysterical, responses on this very site.Avi Noffersnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-51743832128449706692014-03-24T02:46:17.469+02:002014-03-24T02:46:17.469+02:00The court HAS awarded the mother visitation rights...The court HAS awarded the mother visitation rights, yet the father feels he is entitled to regularly cancel these visits, often without giving any reason.<br /><br />Courtnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-75185657030999407682014-03-24T02:35:06.304+02:002014-03-24T02:35:06.304+02:00Avi Noffers What is the courts reasoning for t...Avi Noffers What is the courts reasoning for their decision? We have repeatedly asked, but have been ignored. This tells us one thing that <br />there is no reason and this makes the decision unjust! Brian Ingramnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-88578549579334129612014-03-24T00:14:55.078+02:002014-03-24T00:14:55.078+02:00Avi Noffers:
How has your position changed over t...Avi Noffers:<br /><br />How has your position changed over the last year on this matter? <br /><br />ThanksBravnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-71444907606113679742014-03-23T18:39:17.344+02:002014-03-23T18:39:17.344+02:00As far as I understand, it has been tried at two l...As far as I understand, it has been tried at two levels in Austria. The court HAS offered reasoning for its decision. The losing side rejected it.Avi noffersnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-68119900706765700712014-03-23T14:52:24.420+02:002014-03-23T14:52:24.420+02:00Avi Noffers The court has not offered any proper ...Avi Noffers The court has not offered any proper and just reasoning for their decision. Don't you think that as there is nothing clear about this case that retrial is in order?Brian Ingramnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-1405594620870062162014-03-23T12:04:29.789+02:002014-03-23T12:04:29.789+02:00Although I have stated last week that my position ...Although I have stated last week that my position on this has changed in the past year (hi Avrohom!!) I must say that if these are the two most 'significant' letters then her support is poor.<br />The letter from Jonathan Arkush admits that he does not have full cognisance of the case and I am amazed that such a respected solicitor can issue a letter in such circumstances.<br /><br />The letter from Rabbi Guttentag is simply ridiculous; remarkable in a glaring omission of any facts at all. Much of his statement seems to rely on an opinion of his wife who taught Beth at least 12 years ago!Avi noffersnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-5233586982099126472014-03-23T11:50:56.021+02:002014-03-23T11:50:56.021+02:00I think your first question is phrased the wrong w...I think your first question is phrased the wrong way round.Avi noffersnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-54710690423558134892014-03-23T08:45:00.705+02:002014-03-23T08:45:00.705+02:00Sammy you spelt my name wrong. My name is TOVA HO...Sammy you spelt my name wrong. My name is TOVA HOLLANDER! I don't know if the Austrian one who you decribe as evil spells it the same way! <br />If she does, please don't confuse us. I would not wish to be associated with <br />her. She is a disgrace to the Hollander <br />name!<br />Tova Hollandernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-50965747629746732502014-03-23T08:15:55.370+02:002014-03-23T08:15:55.370+02:00TOVA HOLLENDER! Interesting how two people with t...TOVA HOLLENDER! Interesting how two people with the same name have two such different opinions! One is EVIL and one is KIND The evil one has no place in the human race! All she wants to do is as much damage as she can! . She doesn't care about two innocent little children. She sounds like she has a screw loose! I really have concerns about her! I wouldn't be surprised if she is the one behind <br />this whole conspiracy, driving the <br />father! She knows the true state of the <br />boys, yet she doesn't care! Wake up Austria to this woman's evil ways. What women, mother, grandmother <br />behaves like this? Only an evil one!Sammynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-23673654009944505582014-03-23T07:56:24.877+02:002014-03-23T07:56:24.877+02:00I agree Tova, Brian Jonathan Arkush and all Beth&#...I agree Tova, Brian Jonathan Arkush and all Beth's supporers who have said that the court have shown no good reason, nor has the father, <br />expect to say fathers are entitled to <br />custody.<br />These children were taken away from their mother for no good reason and need to be returned to her. All the <br />father is doing is laughing!. He doesn'<br />t care about the children. This is just a power struggle! ! . He is playing <br />games at his children's expense. It's so obvious! So cruel! Rachel Levynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-24442104360205861412014-03-22T20:47:28.622+02:002014-03-22T20:47:28.622+02:00If their is no justification for the children to ...If their is no justification for the children to be with the father they should never have been taken away from the mother. Therefore, Sammy and Benji should now be returned to Beth.Tova Hollandernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-44874404258942101402014-03-21T16:08:42.599+02:002014-03-21T16:08:42.599+02:00No it is not - we have been through this before.
...No it is not - we have been through this before.<br /><br />http://daattorah.blogspot.co.il/2012/07/rav-sternbuch-divorcewho-gets-custody.htmlDaas Torahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07252904288544083215noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-36022173185731112622014-03-21T15:54:24.470+02:002014-03-21T15:54:24.470+02:00The Halachic position on custody is that father is...The Halachic position on custody is that father is awarded custody of sons once they are no longer breast-feeding.Shulchan Aruchnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-62636275308135232572014-03-21T13:24:13.829+02:002014-03-21T13:24:13.829+02:00You are right Rabbi Biderman and Dr Bowman. What w...You are right Rabbi Biderman and Dr Bowman. What will make the father act on his children's best interests. They don't talk coherently at almosr five.<br />Beth was blamed for their lack of speech development at 2. However, she is a professional language teacher <br />teaching other people's children language. How is it Beth the mother with great parenting skills. a proficient <br />teacher of language is being denied access to her children when they need her so much? I am very much with Jonathan Arkush of the BoD <br /> Something has gone very wrong in this case and questions need <br />answering!Brian Ingramnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-77501555409506479032014-03-21T13:05:25.717+02:002014-03-21T13:05:25.717+02:00Look Schlesinger has proved his abuse to Beth afte...Look Schlesinger has proved his abuse to Beth after the marriage, so its proof he must have been an abusive husband before. What does that make the Courts? Abusive of course!!Audreynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-85350687676460513762014-03-21T11:24:23.130+02:002014-03-21T11:24:23.130+02:00All these rabbis and leaders are speaking out for ...All these rabbis and leaders are speaking out for justice, yet there is still silence from EVERY chabad rabbi around the world. Maybe they're just too busy fundraising for their chabad houses and ensuring they have the right friends in the right places to worry about inconveniences like justice.Bidermannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-91105177158263994652014-03-21T11:11:25.635+02:002014-03-21T11:11:25.635+02:00Ry, have you ever thought about the halachic posit...Ry, have you ever thought about the halachic position on this case? Have you ever heard of something called Torah?Torahnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-66567169270751967632014-03-21T10:26:27.311+02:002014-03-21T10:26:27.311+02:00Do you mean the starting position after the father...Do you mean the starting position after the father tried to have the mother committed to a mental home?homenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-81780969926149972442014-03-21T10:25:19.820+02:002014-03-21T10:25:19.820+02:00Ry, the problem is that in Vienna, the starting po...Ry, the problem is that in Vienna, the starting point is to look for which person is most abusive and violent, then award that person custody so that he can neglect the children. This is nothing to do with feminism and everything to do with the welfare of children, which sadly is something ry can't comprehend.starting pointnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-58753550519560115172014-03-21T09:08:53.639+02:002014-03-21T09:08:53.639+02:00RY why shouldn't Beth fight for custody of he...RY why shouldn't Beth fight for custody of her children? If the boot was on the other foot, wouldn't the father be fighting for his children? <br />There is no clear reason for Beth not to have custody is there? What good reason has the Court given? I say <br />challenge it Beth. The father will never <br />round a table and be reasonable. He <br />never has! Beth. Sammy and Benji <br />deserve to have you, Beth, their loving <br />capable mother! Go for it! We, your supporters are behind you all the way Beth!Tova Hollamdernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-55613276280442314202014-03-21T08:36:39.300+02:002014-03-21T08:36:39.300+02:00what about overnight stays. not having to pay to s...what about overnight stays. not having to pay to see her children, taking them to the uk for holidays. not beinf rejected at their nursery. being told about their development. the list is endless. They will only thrive if she is involved more.<br />My last point is that I am sure the father will still have issues if she agreed. I can see him saying one thing but doing another. Dr Mark Bowmannoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-4972581754917378792014-03-21T02:57:42.988+02:002014-03-21T02:57:42.988+02:00What would they be satisfied with? Beth can be giv...What would they be satisfied with? Beth can be given additional visitation rights; but as long as she will be fighting to take custody away from the father, there is no way she will receive any cooperation while she is waging that war against him. Let her agree that he will maintain primary custody and then he can agree that she can receive additional visitation without hindrance.RYnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-42129512180507863112014-03-21T02:53:56.901+02:002014-03-21T02:53:56.901+02:00"I continue to be at a loss to understand why...<i>"I continue to be at a loss to understand why the Court did not take as its starting position that the custody of young children should be with their mother."</i><br /><br />That's your problem, Sir. That is an incorrect starting point. And if your "starting points" are based on feminist ideology of women first, mother's first, wives first, you can suffer the consequences when society rejects it.<br /><br />There is absolutely no reason the "starting position" should be "that the custody of young children should be with their mother." The father has an equal right to request and receive primary custody.RYnoreply@blogger.com