tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post3638951891938651597..comments2024-03-28T21:30:33.665+02:00Comments on Daas Torah - Issues of Jewish Identity: Abuse - Sex and Kiruv IIDaas Torahhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07252904288544083215noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-12512796706901079392009-06-13T01:09:39.349+03:002009-06-13T01:09:39.349+03:00Again, I am most surprised that Rabbi Eidensohn/da...Again, I am most surprised that Rabbi Eidensohn/da'as torah misses the point:<br /><br />That <b>kiruv is NOT about reaching out to gentiles</b> nor is it about converting gentiles into Jews which is something entirely different. <br /><br />Indeed, of all people Rabbi Eidensohn should know the fundamental difference between forbidden proselytizing to gentiles and kiruv rechoking to genuine halachik Jews albeit secular and even atheistic ones, <br /><br />The process of proselytizing and trying to be megayer goyim IS NOT kiruv rechokim which is all about reaching out and trying to educate and make frum people who are born 100% halachically Jewish, and are at present secular, the frum-to-be potential baalei teshuva which is not what a goy is, even the most interested and beautiful ones, it is forbidden to teach a goy Torah al pi Halacha.<br /><br />In fact it is also wrong to try to locate the actual first kiruv worker/rabbi. <br /><br />Perhaps it is more helpful to see who Chazal regard as the first and greatest baal teshuva and it's not hard to know that that special position belongs to Dovid HaMelech himself according to Chazal. <br /><br />But it would still take three millenia for the world to arrive at an era of Baalei Teshuva, which really only happens on a vast scale after World War Two, when at a time when the majority of Jews are secular and removed from Torah Judaism, there begins a process of return to Judaism as a noteworthy phenomenon in Jewish history because prior to the Holocaust once Jews became secular they never returned to Toarh observance ever again. Return by secular JEWS to Torah-true Judaism was something that only began in large numbers in the 1960s.<br /><br />Perhaps one could claim that Rav Avraham Yitschok HaCohen Kook was the first great rov to recognize this and foresaw that the secular Zionist pioneers in Eretz Yisrael would one day lead the way and become chozrei b'teshuva. He went out of his way to mekarev them and took much criticism for that from other rabbonim. Or perhaps the last Lubavitcher Rebbe, Rabbi Menachem Mendel Schneerson was the first rabbi who actually organized a mass international movement of followers, the shluchim and shluchos, to go out and mekarev Jews all over the world, whcih they continue to do. Aish, Ohr Somayach, and others are all imitators of this approach. He started this in earnest in the 1960s and the Haredi world, including all the yeshivas that now follow his lead by encouraging it, all made fun of him and attacked Lubavitch for its pioneering kiruv work.<br /><br />So it is somewhat ridiculous to look for someone like Zimri in the Midbar who got himself killed for a different reason, in the heat of battle he compromised himself by fraternising with the enemy and was punished with summary execution, haboel aramis kanoi'm pog'im bo, as a halacho lemoshe misinai, and he got what he deserved for literally "sleeping with the enemy", but that episode has absolutely zero to do with "kiruv" as we understand that term today which is all about being mekarev acheinu <b>bnai Yisroel</b> leAvihem shebashomayim.Recipients and Publicitynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-6766415376911602912009-06-12T15:14:01.923+03:002009-06-12T15:14:01.923+03:00thanks!thanks!Daas Torahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07252904288544083215noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-10128780388386935942009-06-12T15:10:26.415+03:002009-06-12T15:10:26.415+03:00Sorry forgot to add:
Yechave Da'at Helek 4:47
...Sorry forgot to add:<br />Yechave Da'at Helek 4:47<br />The Ben Ish Hai's various commentaries on Y"D 246.<br />Ohr Tzadikim 22:30<br />Kaf HaHaim 155:12 <br />Even HaShoham 246<br /><br />I will try to pin down more specific sources dealing exclusively with women, but these should start to paint a good picture.<br />You have my email, feel free to send me any questions, and I will try to help you find helpful sources.Rabbi Michael Tzadokhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02307256653501750003noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-64228173950996598652009-06-12T14:55:32.058+03:002009-06-12T14:55:32.058+03:00I should have known that if I offered...
Some sou...I should have known that if I offered...<br /><br />Some sources that come immediately to mind on the pre-reqs to studying Kabbalah and its laws are:<br /><br />Eitz Haim Introduction 1&2 of R' Haim Vital<br /><br />Deah VHaskel by R' Ovadia Hadayya<br />helek 1, siman 1 and helek 2 siman 1<br /><br />Rav Pealim Volume 1 Yorah Deah 56.<br /><br />I know there are many others, but from those alone I believe you will find that what most people are teaching as "Kabbalah" today has serious issues.<br /><br />I will look up some more specific sources.<br /><br />As far as Chassidus goes... I am really not sure. That would make for an interesting discussion. My own thoughts are that it would depend upon the Chassidus. For instance Tanya has much of the sexual overtones of Kabbalah removed. Whereas others that stay more true to the interaction of the upper-worlds can be quite explicit.Rabbi Michael Tzadokhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02307256653501750003noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-78445759524255231552009-06-12T13:55:33.252+03:002009-06-12T13:55:33.252+03:00We also find the dictate that it is ossur to learn...We also find the dictate that it is ossur to learn Kabbalah with, or to teach Kabbalah to women. The Ben Ish Hai as well as R' Ovadiah Hadayya have both dealt with this subject at length in their various works. I can look up exact references if anyone wants them.<br />===============<br />I am very interested. Does this include chassidus?Daas Torahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07252904288544083215noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7309929059139673041.post-83680706557664818002009-06-12T13:32:00.271+03:002009-06-12T13:32:00.271+03:00Rav Tzadok also notes that sexual lust is a major ...<i>Rav Tzadok also notes that sexual lust is a major problem for those studying kabbala because there are many sexual concepts. In fact a number of years ago there was a kabbalist in the Old City who had a study group with women and it was discovered he was having intimate relations with a number of them.<br /></i><br />Thus we find the dictate that one must be married in order to learn Kabbalah. In fact there are certain subjects that one is only supposed to learn when one's wife is tahor, and thus permitted to him, so that should the sitra achra try to twist the holy teachings of the Kabbalah into something perverse, one has an outlet that is within the bounds of kedusha.<br /><br />We also find the dictate that it is ossur to learn Kabbalah with, or to teach Kabbalah to women. The Ben Ish Hai as well as R' Ovadiah Hadayya have both dealt with this subject at length in their various works. I can look up exact references if anyone wants them. <br /><br />It should also be noted that R' Chaim Vital, in his introduction to Eitz Haim, and the RaShaSh in his introduction to Nahar Shalom, both state that if one has Shalom Bayit issues that one is also forbidden from studying Kabbalah. It is incredibly difficult to explain this to someone who does not study Kabbalah and thus understand the immense spiritual forces involved. However, to paraphrase R' Kaduri Z"L, for one to become a Kabbalist, this takes many years, not only must he learn the requisite material, but know how to put it into practice L'shem Shmayim. He must purify his soul, until he has attained a level of tzadikut, and seeing this all of the forces of the sitra achra array against him. R' Kaduri Z"l told me that even at his advanced age he still struggled immensely with the sitra achra. This was why when his first wife died in 1989, despite his already advanced age, he remarried fairly quickly.<br /><br />As far as "Kabbalists" having study groups with women, this is an on going problem, not only in the Old City, but throughout Jerusalem. There always seems to be issues of moral failures arising from these groups. There is no end to women who want to learn Kabbalah. My wife enjoys having Sem girls as guests for Shabbat. 9 out of 10 inevitably ask for me to teach them Kabbalah. I have stopped saying no. Instead I simply say, "Every time a Rav has taught to Kabbalah to a woman who is not his wife, he has ended up having illicit relations with her." There is invariable a look of shock on the girl's face, but at least I don't have to argue with them over it, the invariably drop the request after that.Rabbi Michael Tzadokhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02307256653501750003noreply@blogger.com